Horizontal shirt stripes

[couch]

^ Also a good illustration of etutee's point about the light/warm color of the tie coming forward while the cooler blue recedes in relation to the tie and collar, so that they don't compete for attention.

(It is a traditional technique of landscape painting to concentrate warm colors in the foreground, neutrals in the middle distance, and hazy cool blues in the background to further the illusion of depth. Works for clothes too.)

In contrast to paintings, human beings are already three-dimensional objects. Quite why the "illusion of depth" is required I am not sure. The shirt looks like something that should be worn on the golf course.

The point is not about striped shirts per se, but about using the theory of color perception to manage the relationships among potentially assertive elements of dress. As Etutee shows, light colors appear to come forward while darker ones recede; warm hues come forward while cool ones recede (the landscape analogy applies here because our eye-brain is conditioned to this sequence by the effects of atmosphere in the natural world), and intense high-chroma colors come forward while duller, unsaturated ones recede. The effect of actual colors in combination depends on the balancing of such effects. So if a pattern such as a horizontal stripe might draw disproportionate attention, it can be "pushed toward the background" by using mass (solid tie, limited exposure in the jacket V) and color (lighter or more intense tie and collar than shirt). These effects are basic and apply in many situations; both AA/Esquire and Alden have discussed "neutralizers" and "noise absorbers," which are simply shorthand terms for items that deploy the effects.

Your strong reaction illustrates my original point that wearers of horizontally striped shirts must be prepared for strong reactions. For those, apparently unlike yourself, who still wish to venture, we've been discussing ways of mitigating the risks. While Etutee says one should not think in terms of making a statement, Manself reads Don Jaime's shirt as "too jazzy," which is an implied judgment about the wearer's taste and the assertiveness of the pattern: thus both you ("should be worn on the golf course") and Manself are evaluating Don Jaime's sartorial statement, whether he thought of himself as making one or not. So Etutee's counsel for wearers is wise: know your current limitations (including your comfort with nonconformity).

[couch]

In view of the lively interest in this topic, it may be relevant to note that the current intro video on the Purple Label section of the Ralph Lauren web site pans across close-ups of two different (both quite bold) horizontally striped shirts--both with white collars and both worn with dark gray three-piece suits (one of which seems to have a vertically striped vest under a solid jacket).

[Scot]

In view of the lively interest in this topic, it may be relevant to note that the current intro video on the Purple Label section of the Ralph Lauren web site pans across close-ups of two different (both quite bold) horizontally striped shirts--both with white collars and both worn with dark gray three-piece suits (one of which seems to have a vertically striped vest under a solid jacket).

Enough said really.

[JDelage]

I saw over the week-end a man wearing a dress shirt with stripes at 45 degrees. They were white & royal blue candy stripes, and the collar had the stripes running in the traditional direction. The stripes met at an angle where the shirt was buttoned, but unfortunately I cannot recall if they were forming ^ or V shapes. It looked pretty good, rather better than the Jaime de Marichalar picture as far as I'm concerned.

[dopey]

An older colleague of mine wore a horizontal striped shirts of blue and white pencil stripes of nearly equal width. I was shocked to see a pocket on it. He wasn't wearing a coat or a tie as is his habit most of the time - he has too much Californian in him - but per my post in the topic of the week thread, a long life, well-lived contributes more than enough grace to any attire.

A small digression - the next two days that I saw him, he was in suit and tie - he wears MTM Brioni from the NY Brioni store and generally looks very good. To my surprise, he was wearing on one day a three button SB suit. He usually wears DB. He is a shortish, portly man and the SB suit, though well fitted, looked awful on him cut in the columnar Brioni style. But his DB suits look very well on him. I wonder if a 3 button SB suit done in the Brioni cut but bespoke would look any better on him than the MTM. My guess is likely not, and he would simply need a much different cut for SB. I guess there is a reason 80% of his suits are DB.

[Leon]

A 'jazzy' shirt of D. Jaime's. This one i think it a bit much.

Leon

[Bespoken2]

I saw over the week-end a man wearing a dress shirt with stripes at 45 degrees. They were white & royal blue candy stripes, and the collar had the stripes running in the traditional direction. The stripes met at an angle where the shirt was buttoned, but unfortunately I cannot recall if they were forming ^ or V shapes. It looked pretty good, rather better than the Jaime de Marichalar picture as far as I'm concerned.

Gents,

I am late to this discussion and I must have my say in regards to horizontally striped shirtings: I reference the above quote only for the reason it triggered my memory that I have such a dress shirt, purchased from Bergdorf's back in the mid-to-late 90's! I don't believe I was the gent that was seen in the shirt referenced above!
I have 10 such shirts in my collection. I wear them with pride and sophistication. I have been following this style ever since seeing an ad around the time after the filming of Wallstreet by the Shirt Shop; located off of Broadway around 44th Street. I believe my first forays into ordering custom shirting; I had shirts made with the horizontal stripping. I recall seeing in Alan Flusser's early books and other menswear publications, early designs and applications of said shirtings going back to the early 20th century. I thought it was a design that really set apart men who thought very seriously about how they dressed themselves and wanted to set themselves apart from the ordinarily dressed guy on the street. I have always gotten very encouraging comments when wearing these shirts. I still do. I do get my [small] share of strange looks and non comments, too! Mostly from other gents who don't know the idea of sartorial dressing from soft serve ice cream! The woman that appreciate the style usually comment favorably and sometimes I can tell that they would love for their significant others could look so swell.
I have worn the shirts with single and double breasted suiting to great affect. I must admit, I take alot of my cues from Alan Flusser, being though in my experience he has been a proponent of the style for decades! I have very bold strippings and very subtle strippings as well. Whenever I see another gent dress elegantly in such shirting, it tells me he is a guy that knows a thing or two about dressing beyond what most men consider to be fine dressing. Perhaps, he being a "clothes horse".
In fact, just recently I have had 2 shirts commissioned for casual wear, short sleeved, mind you for dressing 'down' occasions with horizontal black and burgandy thin strippings, respectively. I took my cue this time from the Duke of Windsor in a picture I'm sure most of us have seen in a short sleeved shirt with horizontal stripping. I had occasion this past weekend to wear my new aquisition to an affair, with summer weight cream trousers, with the burgandy stripped shirt, blue Peaked lapel blazer (Peak lapels is the only jacket collar style I wear!) and I thought the look was quite smashing!!
For the record, I've ordered the shirts with white collars/cuffs and the shirts completely stripped collars/cuffs. I do not feel the look to be inappropriate or 'vulgar' by any means! I've worn it in very dressed up occasions and more relaxed situations. I have found for the most part, the reception has been a very favorable one in my case...in fact, in the case of one my colleagues; as well. The reception of wearing the shirtings has been very positive. I'd say order a couple and have fun with them!

B-spoken-2

[JDelage]

Do the stripes on your shirts form a V or a ^?

[Bespoken2]

A 'V'....audio visual.

B-Spkn2

[couch]

Thanks to Uppercase for posting two pics of Vittorio de Sica wearing the same horizontally striped shirt, with a starched to-attach collar:




Of course, movie lights can create strange effects, but it appears that both collar and shirt front are starched and pressed so highly that they are reflective, almost glossy. It does make a contrast with all the other textured garments he's wearing, but it would be a bit unusual these days.

[Etutee]

hello

but it appears that both collar and shirt front are starched and pressed so highly that they are reflective, almost glossy.

correct, that is a bib front starched shirt but it is not horizontal striped body. Only the bib area. It is an old version of morning day wear shirts which would make sense considering he is wearing odd db vest like formal daywear and he wore spats. Note the vertical stripes around armscye on shirt body.

here are 2 pictures



and you can see some very interesting things in this picture below. note the shirring at shoulder and the shirt is likely missing a gauntlet (could be unbuttoned though).

[J.S. Groot]

A question on the DB:

While it is true that wearing a DB will result in less visible shirt, which a horizontally striped shirt could be preferable, in Etutee's photos it seems to me that the almost horizontal peaks on the lapels enhances the horizontal stripes on the shirt. This is especially true for the high contrast ensembles in the first two photo, where my eyes fix on the triangle of horizontal stripes immediately, despite the relatively small size of said triangle compared to the rest of the outfit. Is this intentional? If not, is it something that should be taken into consideration?

Cheers.

[Costi]

That's an interesting variation, etutee - only the stripes you see (with the coat on) are horizontal...

[...] the shirt is likely missing a gauntlet (could be unbuttoned though).

I think I do see the gauntlet on that sleeve (very carefully pattern matched), but I would note the absence of a gauntlet button (my shirtmaker's default is always without, and not because she is lazy, but because she thinks it is not necessary).

[dopey]

Re the gauntlet button. I am certain there is no gauntlet button present on de Sica's shirt. The reason I say that is that I have recently been experimenting with a Neapolitan shirtmaker to replace my long-standing English one, and I asked for French cuffs on the sleeves. I raised the issue of a gauntlet button, since, while I am not sure I have a preference for one, it something I have always had. The shirtmaker was insistent that a French cuff should never have a gauntlet button and that the button should only be used on more sportier shirts. I acquiesced and was rewarded with the most beautiful gauntlet placket I have ever seen. the placket is two and a half to three inches wide and rather than overlap to close, it is formed with a u-shaped opening that has at its base, a beautiful long curved bar tack. It is only a sleeve placket, but it is exceptionally beautiful. On the other hand, I am also trying a new English shirtmaker, and he was happy to put in a gauntlet button.

Re de Sica's bib front, I have a formal shirt made with a heavy white pique front but the body of poplin with a bold black, sky blue and white fancy stripe. So long as the DJ is on, nothing of the stripes is visible.

[couch]

Thanks to etutee and dopey for these elaborations. I do like de Sica's bib-front shirt. Dopey, is the non-overlapping placket a trait of Neapolitan makers generally, or just this house (and would you be willing to divulge its name)?

During the hiatus in this thread I happened to watch several episodes from the first full season ('62) of The Avengers (Julie Stevens and Honor Blackman). I note that Patrick Macnee as Steed spent a lot of time that season in horizontally striped shirts with white collars.