"English" shoemakers

[Guest]

Can someone please confirm for me that:
* John Lobb (London and Paris) is owned by Hermes (French).
* Edward Green is owned by Herme (French)
* Church's is owned 55% by Prada (Italian), 45% by Equinox (Swiss)

Thanks.

[Guest]

John Lobb (Paris) is owned by Hermes. It is run as an independent company with its own stores and channels of distribution.

John Lobb (Paris) consists of the bespoke shoemaking operations in Paris and the RTW shoes sold around the world. The RTW is made in England.

In the beginning John Lobb (Paris) was the branch of the original John Lobb, John Lobb (London) was and is solely a bespoke shoemaker. The Paris branch was sold to Hermes, and I believe that Hermes also purchased the right to market John Lobb RTW. I believe that there was some litigation over the sale, but it has been resolved.

Therefore, if you buy a John Lobb RTW shoe, it is John Lobb (Paris) made in England.

John Lobb (Paris) bespoke is made in Paris. John Lobb (Paris) RTW is made in a factory in Northampton, England, the shoemaking capital of England. John Lobb (Paris) had purchased the Edward Green factory, and Green relocated.

Edward Green is an independent company. It merely sold its factory to John Lobb (Paris). Green moved to other quarters in Northampton.

I do not know much about about the ownership of Church. It is my understanding that it is owned by Prada. If Equinox were the minority partner I would figure that Prada would be calling the shots.

[Guest]

So,
- John Lobb (London) is not owned by Hermes?
- John Lobb (Paris) is owned by Hermes and uses and abuses the brand of "John Lobb"!

[Guest]

. . . . John Lobb (Paris) is owned by Hermes and uses and abuses the brand of "John Lobb"!

Hermes paid Lobb for the name and are using it per their agreement (I assume, as I am not aware of any lawsuit). That is hardly abuse.

[Guest]

not technically but emotionally. in my mind rebranding something ruins it for me in terms of the essence of all that a product represents. it is a product without soul.

[Guest]

the purchase of a brand and use of it is a deceitful trick which abuses us consumers. it thrusts a quality name at us rather than a quality product.

[Guest]

I'm not sure how anyone can say that Lobb Paris shoes, ready-to-wear or bespoke, are not quality products. Indeed, there are very few shoes out there that could compare to either.

RJ

[Guest]

Hermes has had full ownership of John Lobb Paris since 1976, hardly a recent development, and by no means has tried to decieve the public in the knowledge of that. They've insisted on keeping the production of the RTW lines in England and have maintained, in my opinion, an outstanding product. I don't think I've ever heard someone claim that Lobb Paris wasn't quality, in fact some of their bespoke are among the best examples I've seen.

- Jackson

[Guest]

John Lobb Paris is a fine product but I see it as a product with John Lobb in name but not John Lobb in essence - like it has become manhandled by corporation not cradled by artisan (which is what i like with bespoke).

[Guest]

There are actually two separate John Lobbs. The RTW company is the one owned by Hermes, with premises on Jermyn St in London. However, the bespoke company is still trading from its original premises on St James's St, and as far as I know it is stiill family owned.

So, if what you're after is a pair of bespoke JL's, head to the St James's premises - or check out www.johnlobbltd.co.uk.

[Guest]

So, if what you're after is a pair of bespoke JL's, head to the St James's premises - or check out www.johnlobbltd.co.uk.

Strictly speaking, you can also get bespoke shoes from JL Paris, and many rate them higher than the St. James product. Whether they are as authentically English in style is another matter.

[Noble's Comb]

Thanks to the dreaded globalisation it's all a bit blurred nowadays!

Just because Honda assemble the CR-V at Swindon (or BMW the Mini at Oxford), does it make either of them an "British" car.
Personally, I don't think it does.

I think that Crockett & Jones is still an independantly owned British firm & hasn't been swallowed by a multi-national "luxury goods" conglomerate.

[storeynicholas]

The world of business involves business dealings and that means mergers and acquisitions and changes of ownership of running concerns - that have good will and custom, through the name. Even Selfridge's was the creation of, and belonged to, one (remarkable) man Gordon Selfridge - until the Dolly Sisters got hold of him . One of the few benefits of all the EU regulation has been the Transfer of Undertakings Regulations that provide for continuity of employment on transfers of businesses - so that the staff (including in-house craftsmen) remain the same. This is good for the staff (they keep their jobs) and good for the customers (they retain confidence in the products). Maybe it is galling that, for good examples, Rolls Royce, Bentley and Jaguar and Daimler are no longer British - owned because the companies became fouled up by production and running costs but their history, as creators of wonderful machines, is safe and so, to some extent, is their future as businesses. If you go through records, such as those held by the National Archives, you will see just how many businesses that there once were, employing artisan craftsmen - hundreds of them - all now down to a handful - although there are still surprisingly many gunmakers. But shoe-makers - really old firms with wonderful reputations built long, long before John Lobb had been a twinkle in a Tywardreath eye - let alone thrown out by Old Man Thomas - Peal & Co (1565-1965), Hoby ('The Great'), Thomas, Joseph Box, Gundry - are all gone the way of all flesh; the same goes for the hatters - Lincoln Bennett (Herbert Johnson's apprentice master), Henry Heath, Scott's and so on - and they didn't just sell hats they made them. As for British cars - go through a 'classic car' type of magazine and you will be astonished at the numbers of British car companies that there were - from Armstrong Siddley and Aston Martin and Austin - nearly right the way through the alphabet. Nearly all gone (Bristol and Morgan are notable survivors) because they couldn't survive as businesses - so, when businesses can find a way to continue, then they should be allowed to do so. 'Globalization' is here to stay - so is the increasing production of tat of various kinds - from clothing to food to housing and there is not much that we can do to stop the general rot except decline to participate in its consumption - which is what the Lounge is partly about - preservation and perpetuation of the older values and standards in production of goods. Every time that I have, for one reason or another (generally: hurry, hunger and convenience) had one of Ronald's (rather pointless) burgers and fries, I have cursed my own weakness - but I am now removed from temptation - of course there are a couple of Ronald MacDonald's joints in Rio - but not yet in the Sleepy Hollow - if you want a burger here: (a) it comes from a bullock - steer and (b) it's locally made by a butcher or an independent restaurant. Brazil is a bit behind the times in some ways - but in these ways, I revel in it.
NJS

[oldog/oldtrix]

As for British cars - go through a 'classic car' type of magazine and you will be astonished at the numbers of British car companies that there were - from Armstrong Siddley and Aston Martin and Austin ....
NJS

Right, so this limerick is meaningless to the youngsters:

There once was a fellow from Boston
Who bought himself a new Austin;
He had room for his ass
And a gallon of gas,
But his balls hung out and he lost 'em.

[couch]

A college friend of mine owned during the 1960s an Austin-Healey 100M LeMans. He lived in a small stone cottage beside a suburban lake (in Texas!), and he had restored the car to rallying specs. You can imagine that he cut a dash with the ladies. Here's the model (not his car); note the leather bonnet strap (added by Donald Healey once he'd made the car so fast that the bonnet latches were not reliable on bumpy roads at speed). One of the great British sports cars:



Although to properly elucidate oldog/oldtrix's limerick, one probably needs to picture the notorious Austin-Healey "bugeye" Sprite:



Cheers,
Couch