some observations and a few specialized questions

[Guest]

1) I am in NYC for a wedding. I stopped by Peter Eliot. He has a shoe shop where he offers bespoke shoes by Bemer. The examples he had were very pretty, $2700 per pair.

2) I received the EG Dundee. It will serve my purposes nicely, but I think I paid too much for it. The EG costs 700 plus shipping, The Alfred Sargent version is not as nice at $200, but with a little thought it could be. I think the Alfred Sargent version (which I threw out because it was so ungainly and unsafe to wear, I know, I know, but trust me). But its most awful characteristic was a truly ungainly last. Why does a company have such an inelegant last? What is the big deal? Please do not attack me about cost and diminishing gains, bla bla bla, and this is not a slam against EG or Tony.

3) A well-known retailer on the fashion boards offered to repair my Italian Martigani shoes. One needed darkening. The other has a scuff.

a. The one he darkened (a special order monk strap) has a grain pattern and now the crevices between the pebbles are darkened. Is this to be expected and will it fade?

b. The scuff (on the instep of a fashion-forward derby) he repaired is better but not gone. Is this normal? I mean, will the scuff become less noticeable or more noticeable with time?

The retailer repaired the shoes for free and if they were not right, I got what I paid for, so I am not looking for advice on how to deal with him.

[jcusey]

1) I am in NYC for a wedding. I stopped by Peter Eliot. He has a shoe shop where he offers bespoke shoes by Bemer. The examples he had were very pretty, $2700 per pair.

I have been told by a knowledgeable source that these shoes are 1500 Euro at the Bemer shop in Firenze, but I suppose that this is to be expected given the fact that there is an added middleman. Eliot is providing a service for those who are interested in Bemer shoes but who do not travel regularly to Firenze, and he deserves to be compensated for it.

3) A well-known retailer on the fashion boards offered to repair my Italian Martigani shoes. One needed darkening. The other has a scuff.

a. The one he darkened (a special order monk strap) has a grain pattern and now the crevices between the pebbles are darkened. Is this to be expected and will it fade?

Shoe polish accumulates in the low places on a shoe upper's surface, just as tarnish accumulates in the crevices of sterling flatware. It's the nature of the beast, and it gives the shoe character.

b. The scuff (on the instep of a fashion-forward derby) he repaired is better but not gone. Is this normal? I mean, will the scuff become less noticeable or more noticeable with time?

If you have scratched the leather, there is nothing that you can do to make the scratch disappear. You can camouflage it, but it will still be there.

The retailer repaired the shoes for free and if they were not right, I got what I paid for, so I am not looking for advice on how to deal with him.

I would suggest thanking him sincerely.

[Guest]

As with most of these retail transactions, price is economic not moral. I do not know, and I do not think that anyone can know, what a retailer "deserves." I guess he "deserves" what someone is willing to pay. I do not need bespoke shoes so I am not even shopping for that sort of thing. I did not like the Bemer RTW examples that were displayed.

By the way, have we established that the shoes called "bespoke" are truly "bespoke?" The same retailer jcusey reminds me to profusely thank has suggested that some of these Italian shoes called "bespoke" are actually more "special-order," though when he made these remarks to me he was referring to Petrarchi not Bemer.

While we are on the subject, I was surprised to see Bemer shoes at Eliot (remember, I am not from NYC). Are there other exotic brands available at other retailers around the city? I know (or I think I know) that Bonora is available at 16 sur 20 and Camponile (sic?) at Kabay (I did not like the latter when I saw them).

Finally, the issue of last. Why is the EG last for the Dundee so much nicer than the AS version of the veldt? How much could getting a new last cost? Are lasts a sort of patrimony that companies inherit, baring a young innovator like Tony who is willing to update or renovate? We are not talking subtle differences either. I do not just toss things out for no reason. By the way, the AS (a company everyone knows I otherwise like) veldts were so stiff that this made the sole more slippery than it had to be, that was the dangerous part. I also tossed out a pair of rubber soled brogues by AS with corrected grain leather called "Weathertuf." Those were safe and their design was fine, but the leather made them completely insuitable for anything but knock-around. A particularly sarcastic nurse I used to have to work with used to comment that they were my "Doc Martins."

[Jobanovic]

The same retailer jcusey reminds me to profusely thank has suggested that some of these Italian shoes called "bespoke" are actually more "special-order," though when he made these remarks to me he was referring to Petrarchi not Bemer.

My name is Ron Rider and I am the Market Manager for Romano Martegani responsible for the US and Canada. I also take care of the shoe operation inside of Franco's Fine Clothier in Richmond, VA. I am the 'retailer' that obviously was not able to satisfy Dr. Bresch's situation with his scuffed shoes. Dr. Bresch, you have my cell number...you have never had a problem reaching me before, so there should not be any problem on how to 'deal' with me now. There seemed to us to be a time constraint you were under for the return of your shoes, so, as I explained, I was not able to tend to these with my own hands, as I was traveling for Martegani. My shoe man did the best that he could, as per my instructions.

Regardless, my main reson for responding is the quote you attribute to me in regards to Petrarchi (sp?). Obviously, I was not very clear...I know nothing about this firm's production and have no idea whether they have lasts made or alter existing lasts as required. I recall the conversation we had, but apparently you were speaking in specifics and I was speaking in generalities. I apologize for my lack of clearity. I just would like to set the record straight - I know nothing about Petrarchi's production and have no idea what their process' are. I have no problem being quoted on what I say, but I suppose in the future I will have to be more consise during my conversations. Again, I aplogize for not being more clear...

[Guest]

Ron, you did address my problems with the shoes. I inquired about the repairs because I do not know very much about the details of shoe maintenance and repair, and I felt self-conscious calling you after you had repaired them for free. So far as my being under time pressure for the shoes, had you said you needed more time to look at the shoes yourself, I of course would have understood. I am sorry if you felt pressure when there was nothing but concern the shoes not get lost.

I am also sorry I did not accurately paraphrase (anonymously) what you described. I meant your remarks to be anonymous and general, not precise indictments. I hope you won't be TOO concise in the future, because I welcome your discussions of the Italian shoe industry.

[Mark Seitelman]

$700 for an Edward Green is not bad considering that the average price at Saks is $850.

Yes, it's expensive. However, Green is unique among English shoes, and the only shoes which come close are John Lobb and Crockett & Jones (Handgrade).