My shirt collar looks OK? Please advise

[fabrics]

Pictures below show my white collar shirt.
This shirt is made in HK. What do you think?

[Costi]

What fault do you find with it? I mean, given the style...
Perhaps less spread and more tie space would be an improvement. Lower collarband, too? - does it feel comfortable?

[davidhuh]

Dear Fabrics,

I would tie a bigger knot.

Cheers, david

[aston]

Looks somewhat similar to a Hilditch "Prince" collar, which I always think is a good place to start for the shape of a long collar- point cutaway.

[hectorm]

[quote="fabrics"]Pictures below show my white collar shirt.
What do you think?

Dear Fabrics, you just declared open season, so here I go.
IMHO the collar band is too narrow (low) in the back and the whole structure of the collar feels too soft for that collar style and weak against the size of the knot.
Also I would give it a tiny bit more of tie space, and tie the knot a little wider at the top and tighter at the bottom as to make it tidier and show just the knot and less of the rest of the tie under the collar.
Another thing to consider: the notch level of your lapels is IMO way too high (almost at the top of your large tie knot and pretty close to the shoulder seam). This makes, in my view, the whole "V" pretty uptight and off-balance. I´m not sure this could be corrected by changing the shirt collar, though.
Besides all this, you look alright (I run for cover)

[fabrics]

Thank you so much for those comments. I really appreciate them, especially hectorm's.
In the past 3 years, my shirt/collar style is the one you see in the pictures. Although those shirts are comfortable, I do find my overall collar style looks different from other well made shirts. I did specifically request to have slightly higher collarband and a minimal lining in the collar construction, hence the soft feel. This collar style was a derivative off a copy of a Brooks Brothers MTM program English spread collar shirt I had in 1993.
I definitely will lower the notch for my next suit, which is currently in progress.
As you can see, that is a four-in-hand knot. Would a half Windsor knot be ok on me?
BTW, I took those pictures myself while sitting.
Thanks again.
Cheers,

[davidhuh]

As you can see, that is a four-in-hand knot. Would a half Windsor knot be ok on me?

Dear Fabrics,

I would just try to fill the space a little more with your tie knot. How you achieve this will depend on the tie you are using.
A four-in-hand might work out well if the tie is fuller than the one on your pictures. A half windsor might do with the tie you are showing, or the italian knot this gentleman is showing: http://www.gq.com/video/gq-rules/2008/h ... -tie-knots

Cheers, David

[couch]

This is all a matter of taste, to some degree. It's hard to judge how much spread suits you best without seeing the shape of your jaw/face in relation to the length of your neck. If your lower face/jaw is relatively narrow/pointed rather than wide/square, the wider spreads like this will probably be flattering, but a few degrees less spread would not hurt at all. It looks to me as though the points may be just slightly on the short side (just barely covered by the jacket). Is the jacket buttoned in these photos? If not, the point length may be fine. I agree that a bit more tie space would be advantageous. The collar height looks about right in the rear to me (showing about half an inch above the jacket collar, but slightly too high in front for a non-detachable modern collar. One doesn't really want to see the collar band much if any around the tie. With a very slight lowering of the band in front (1/8" or so) and/or a very slightly less wide spread (though still within the category of "spread collar") you could get away with a small tie knot, as Prince Charles does, if you like the style, and still look harmonious. For ties that make a knot as thin as or thinner than the one you show, you could certainly wear a half-Windsor or a double four-in-hand to fill a little more space without looking too symmetrical or bulky. For a spread as wide as you show, the Pratt knot would also be well balanced and smaller than a full Windsor, but it shares the Windsor's objectionable symmetry.

It's a personal preference, but I tend to think of spread collars (especially white) as a bit dressier than medium or long-point collars, and so prefer them to be lined and pressed a bit more crisply. Such a collar leaf might make a flatter angle down from the fold, which might change the effect of the knot placement so that the band did not appear quite so high--you'd have to try the experiment. Again a personal choice, but I'd also consider with a spread collar knotting your tie with one or two dimples, or at least some shirring, so that the tie spreads a little below the knot and does not hang so narrowly and limply for so many inches down the chest. The undimpled look, especially with a tie that is not robust or robustly lined, emphasizes the shirt placket and leaves more exposed shirt in the V than makes for the best balance, in my view. But these are subtleties, and your presentation is hardly blameworthy as it is.

[Berwick]

I think it looks good. It looks to be a bit tight to your neck to me, but if it is comfortable then I am mistaken.

[hectorm]

Thank you so much for those comments. I really appreciate them, especially hectorm's.
As you can see, that is a four-in-hand knot. Would a half Windsor knot be ok on me?

Thank you Fabrics. You have taken it so well.
I think that Couch´s later comments are very on the dot and useful too.
Sometimes -when it comes to collars and tie knots- a single picture (or a clip like in David´s post) is worth a thousand words.
Hereby I post a photograph of what IMO is a very well rounded (balanced and imposing) cutaway and 4 in hand knot combination (you see, I like shirt collars that show more in the back). You could use it as reference. If you wanted a softer collar and a smaller 4 in hand knot you can always look at the PoW. I never liked the Windsor knots.
What do you think?
BTW, good move in bringing the notch level a bit down.

[couch]

Thanks for the kind words, hectorm. In my view, these show good examples of the proportions one is shooting for with a four-in-hand and spread. DB jacket shortens the V, but the collar leaf crispness, collar height front and back in proportion to jacket collar and neck length, tie space, position and tightness (not too tight) of knot, coverage of collar points by jacket and collar band by knot and tie blades, are all exemplary. The dimple helps hold the knot in place and facilitate the lively arch of the blades and coverage of the placket.



This is a pretty good example of the tie, collar, and V for a single-breasted jacket, if perhaps one accessory too many: