4x2 Casual DB Overcoat (Pics Included)

[Badden]

I do like the style of the ‘Guard’s Coat’ below (made by Manolo Costa). Thinking of getting something similar in a 22oz. mid-brown Donegal. I think if it’s executed properly, it would look quite smart, but the big risk is with the button placement.

I’m thinking of having the anchor buttons right on my natural waist, have the two dummy buttons brought in a bit closer, and give the peak lapels quite a bit of belly. Maybe even a half-belt on the back.

Thoughts?

[couch]

Your changes sound right to me. This example's proportions strike me as a bit top-heavy: the lapel line to the button point looks almost as long as the skirt length from button point to hem. The coat appears cut to end at or a little above the knee. If it were a few inches longer the proportions would be quite handsome. If the freedom of movement offered by a shortish overcoat is more valuable to you than the extra warmth, then I think moving the button point up to the waist, which would shorten the lapel line a little and proportionately lengthen the perceived length of skirt, would be desirable. Raising the button point would also raise the crossing point of the overlap to be slightly higher on the chest, so that a scarf would have to do less of the warming work--and perhaps allow the coat to be worn more often without a scarf on milder days.

[JScott]

I agree with couch (and yourself) about raising the buttoning point. However, with this change I think it would really benefit from an additional row of buttons below to balance out the relatively "busy" top. Not sure if you're married to the idea of a 4x2 or not...just my two cents

[alden]

Hi Badden,

I have a 6 x 3 DB coat made in a heavy brown barleycorn that is similar in idea....a more low slung long lapel style. The anchor button is at the top button. The middle button is at the natural waist or slightly above. I like to wear the coat rolled to the middle button creating thus a bit of the effect you seek. The nice thing is that my coat is versatile in the sense that in cool weather, I can batten down the hatches and close the top button. Versatilty means you will likely wear it alot. I think you might tire of the pictured coat in fairly short order.

The Brown Donegal idea with patch pockets makes good sense, but take away the breast pocket. They don't do well together in this instance. The blue OC looks a bit like a DJ elongated and rusticated with the sewn on pockets. Its quite a mix of styles and to my eye it just does not work.

My coat has a Martingale and is cut as a sack. It has no breast pocket. I think rolling to the middle button creates a very nice look. I also cut the collar full so it could be easily hiked up. If you add some nice horn buttons, the coat can be very chic. PS: Not too much belly on the lapels.

Cheers

[Badden]

Food for thought - thanks everyone.

Michael / JScott - you both touched on my concern - that the pictured coat, with its 4x1 configuration, may just be a bit too unusual in real life, thereby diminishing its longevity.

Fwiw, the cloth in question is a stunning mix of Donegal / Shetland produced by Marling & Evans.

I may go for the modified Ulster as shown below (w/o the breast pocket, and with an Ulster collar - thanks, Michael). I will, however, opt for a more fitted look than suggested.

[alden]

. I will, however, opt for a more fitted look than suggested

Badden,

A quick clarification on the function of the martingale. My overcoat, described above, is a sack. It is dartless. But it is fitted when the coat is fastened because the martingale pulls in excess fabric, gives shape to the coat, and does so with lovely pleating in back. That is the way it, classically speaking, is supposed to work.

Very often these days, overcoats are decked out with all sorts of darts to give wonderful shape and then, because it is an exciting optional feature that can be tacked on, the martingale or back belt is sewn on as decoration. But the martingale is not at all decorative, it is functional. And therefore, being functional and not ornamental, it can be elegant if executed properly. If executed properly, because it takes a good deal of tailoring skill to get right.

Good luck with your coat.

Cheers

[Badden]

Got it, that makes sense - thanks, Michael.

[Costi]

This doesn't look much like a Guards' Coat, more like a quirky DB town-ish overcoat.

Here is the effect of the martingale as Michael describes it (and I very much agree with it):



And here is just the right amount of the shape you are looking for:



(sorry to take myself as an example, but that was close to hand)

If you still want to go with 4 buttons, you may place them in a square, with the top ones slightly above natural waist. You have the option to button up the top or let the lapel roll through to the lower button line. Here is an example that I liked so much that I had it made in gray flannel, just as it is in the picture:



(no martingale on this one)

In mid-brown Donegal, however, I think Michael's suggestion of an Ulster-inspired design is best.

On the subject of fitted overcoats - I have a couple and I hate them: they are very uncomfortable. There is friction everywhere and I feel stiff in them. A more loosely shaped overcoat looks and feels much nicer to me - it is more fluid, moves better with me and feels unrestrictive. I feel dressed, rather than bandaged.

[yialabis]

Costi , nice to see you again !!! You look taller and slimmer ...

[Costi]

Nice to see you, too!

In the third photo, you mean
The first one is 4 years old... But I finally stopped growing in both directions since then.

[DFR]

Sadly a very ungainly looking thing. As has been said it is top heavy and I will add that the patch pockets look absolutely wrong - at least without flaps.

Costi, as ever, exudes classic elegance and is well worth thinking about in preference to trying to rectify this dreadful thing.