Hello,
Does anyone else wear a pocket watch as a more or less daily timepiece?
If one is not wearing a vest then it is affixed to the lapel buttonhole and kept in the breast pocket.
Pocket watches.
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Incroyable
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AnthonyJordan
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I tend to wear three-piece suits twice a week and wear a silver half-hunter pocket watch with these as a matter of course. Likewise on the occasions (such as today) when I choose to wear striped or check trousers with doeskin or linen waistcoat and black jacket. When in two-piece I occasionally wear a watch in the breast pocket as you describe but generally prefer to wear a pocket handkerchief and wristwatch instead. The same applies with tweed jackets and the like also, although in the cooler weather I will usually wear waistcoats, in which case the watch is worn on them. With my town suits I wear a longer or shorter silver chain according to whether I am wearing it across a waistcoat or from lapel to breast pocket. With tweeds I wear either the longer chain (with a waistcoat) or a plaited leather strap.
Call it strange but my cellphone serves as my pocketwatch of sorts. I don't even wear a wristwatch because my phone tells the time. Saves me frustration on shirt cuff sizing.
I understand the practicality of the cellphone AKA "pocket watch" (of sorts). Sometimes I too have a dreadful habit of taking it out and having a glance to ascertain time. But I still do wear my silver full-hunter pocket watch, which I usually place in the breast pocket with the chain T-bar in the lapel buttonhole and key fob secured under the lapel with the loop.
I wear pocket watches since I was given my first PW at the tender age of 14 - which resulted in the nickname 'Big Ben' at school.
It did not take longer than to my early student days that I bought my first IWC 14k open face (made in 1909). One of my best (though not prefered in terms of daily wear) finds was a 18k gold hunter minute reapeater chronograph made (better: retailed) by M.F. Dent in 1891. I wore this on a vest during a musical performance (you can virtually feel the time once the slide mechanism is activated).
I do not want to bother this elicit circle with numerous names and types of pocket watches which I wear on certain occasions, but rather continue with some practical aspects:
1) One cannot wear a hunter in the breast pocket and I do not approve of this custom in general (sorry to say that, Incroyable), simply because of the resulting watch chain problems (all right, let's call them challenges):
To be worn in your breast pocket, the watch chain has to be short and thin, otherwise the risk of scratching your valuable timepiece rises considerably (the chain always slides into that breast pocket, any other styles to wear it, showing off the chain, would be appaling). Try to open the cover of a hunter attached to a short chain on your buttonhole and you will understand my point.
2) In the (at least, sartorically) glorious 1930s, gentlemen prefered to wear slimmer and smaller (12size) open face pocket watches, even though the custom of sporting a wrist watch (its origins came from the First World War when in the trenches officers needed both hands, so they attached their PWs to their wrists with a leather strap) increased in popularity. If not worn on the vest, they were fixed with long chains to the right trouser pocket (which had a small watch pouch inside) ot to a special watch pocket in the trouser front.
I do find this method quite convenient and adaptable for a lot of PW styles (very occasionally a hunter or - more english - a half-hunter; 18 size open face Railroad watches, but usually I have a 16 size open face Hamilton 992 in my pocket). They do not scratch too much this way. T-bar chains do not suit here, except of those which have a facilty to detach the T-bar.
3) Extra heavy hunters (like those made in the 1820s-1860s in England) look best on a sturdy chain with a 3 PC tweed suit. I sometimes use the ticket pocket on my hacking jacket for this purpose (which of course cannot be considered 'correct').
It did not take longer than to my early student days that I bought my first IWC 14k open face (made in 1909). One of my best (though not prefered in terms of daily wear) finds was a 18k gold hunter minute reapeater chronograph made (better: retailed) by M.F. Dent in 1891. I wore this on a vest during a musical performance (you can virtually feel the time once the slide mechanism is activated).
I do not want to bother this elicit circle with numerous names and types of pocket watches which I wear on certain occasions, but rather continue with some practical aspects:
1) One cannot wear a hunter in the breast pocket and I do not approve of this custom in general (sorry to say that, Incroyable), simply because of the resulting watch chain problems (all right, let's call them challenges):
To be worn in your breast pocket, the watch chain has to be short and thin, otherwise the risk of scratching your valuable timepiece rises considerably (the chain always slides into that breast pocket, any other styles to wear it, showing off the chain, would be appaling). Try to open the cover of a hunter attached to a short chain on your buttonhole and you will understand my point.
2) In the (at least, sartorically) glorious 1930s, gentlemen prefered to wear slimmer and smaller (12size) open face pocket watches, even though the custom of sporting a wrist watch (its origins came from the First World War when in the trenches officers needed both hands, so they attached their PWs to their wrists with a leather strap) increased in popularity. If not worn on the vest, they were fixed with long chains to the right trouser pocket (which had a small watch pouch inside) ot to a special watch pocket in the trouser front.
I do find this method quite convenient and adaptable for a lot of PW styles (very occasionally a hunter or - more english - a half-hunter; 18 size open face Railroad watches, but usually I have a 16 size open face Hamilton 992 in my pocket). They do not scratch too much this way. T-bar chains do not suit here, except of those which have a facilty to detach the T-bar.
3) Extra heavy hunters (like those made in the 1820s-1860s in England) look best on a sturdy chain with a 3 PC tweed suit. I sometimes use the ticket pocket on my hacking jacket for this purpose (which of course cannot be considered 'correct').
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Incroyable
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Rudolf:
Yes, I do agree with you, that a hunter watch with its inherently thicker case, and such does not work well with a breast-pocket. However, the watch I sometimes wear in my breast pocket is a size 12 open face Haas Neveux with a short 19th century gold chain of possible Italian or Spanish make.
It seems that the watch in trouser pocket was popular with platinum chains and watches, which seemed a 30s mode; witness the amounts of platinum dress pocket watches as noted earlier in the black tie thread.
I am curious though,; how many pocket watches do you own? I am actually also thinking of acquiring a wristwatch.
Yes, I do agree with you, that a hunter watch with its inherently thicker case, and such does not work well with a breast-pocket. However, the watch I sometimes wear in my breast pocket is a size 12 open face Haas Neveux with a short 19th century gold chain of possible Italian or Spanish make.
It seems that the watch in trouser pocket was popular with platinum chains and watches, which seemed a 30s mode; witness the amounts of platinum dress pocket watches as noted earlier in the black tie thread.
I am curious though,; how many pocket watches do you own? I am actually also thinking of acquiring a wristwatch.
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Incroyable
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Here is Marcello M. as Guido in 8 1/2 wearing a pocket watch:
Incroyable,
thank you for the interesting contribution on how to wear breast-pocket watches.
I truly admire the swiss company of Haas Neveux (of which I regrettably do not own any specimens), they acted as specialists on complicated watches (minute repeaters). They were successors to B. Haas Jeune , founded around 1867. The company of Haas Neveux & Cie. was registered 1901 in Paris (where B. Haas Jeune had their major dependency), ceasing production (sadly) in 1939. They produced their own watches in Geneva, so they were a genuine manufacturer at about the level of Patek, Philippe & Co..
I bet yours is a nickel bridge movement, higly jeweled (19 and up), with fausses-cotes decoration (commonly called Genevan stripes).
I own more than 40 pocket watches (well, that's not much for a collector), which does not mean anything in terms of quality. Not all of them are repeaters, of course, or even gold watches.
My favourites have always been english precision watches of the late 19th century and american Railroad Watches. Of course, two german Glashutte (one by Lange, one by Union) grace the collection, but those are not my main concern. During the last two decades, they became heavily overpriced, so I save the limited funds for some more interesting pieces from England (e.g. a Cha. Frodsham half-hunter with a genuine english nickel movement which I am extremely proud of).
I have to stop myself at this point, this is NOT the NAWCC watch forum.
Sorry, gentlemen, for being a bit too overtly enthusiastic here
Incroyable,
very interesting (late 1950s ?) picture of Marcello M. - note how short his watch chain appears, almost like a fob (I wonder if it was made originally like that or rather shortened).
thank you for the interesting contribution on how to wear breast-pocket watches.
I truly admire the swiss company of Haas Neveux (of which I regrettably do not own any specimens), they acted as specialists on complicated watches (minute repeaters). They were successors to B. Haas Jeune , founded around 1867. The company of Haas Neveux & Cie. was registered 1901 in Paris (where B. Haas Jeune had their major dependency), ceasing production (sadly) in 1939. They produced their own watches in Geneva, so they were a genuine manufacturer at about the level of Patek, Philippe & Co..
I bet yours is a nickel bridge movement, higly jeweled (19 and up), with fausses-cotes decoration (commonly called Genevan stripes).
I own more than 40 pocket watches (well, that's not much for a collector), which does not mean anything in terms of quality. Not all of them are repeaters, of course, or even gold watches.
My favourites have always been english precision watches of the late 19th century and american Railroad Watches. Of course, two german Glashutte (one by Lange, one by Union) grace the collection, but those are not my main concern. During the last two decades, they became heavily overpriced, so I save the limited funds for some more interesting pieces from England (e.g. a Cha. Frodsham half-hunter with a genuine english nickel movement which I am extremely proud of).
I have to stop myself at this point, this is NOT the NAWCC watch forum.
Sorry, gentlemen, for being a bit too overtly enthusiastic here
Incroyable,
very interesting (late 1950s ?) picture of Marcello M. - note how short his watch chain appears, almost like a fob (I wonder if it was made originally like that or rather shortened).
Last edited by Rudolf on Thu Oct 20, 2005 5:59 am, edited 1 time in total.
No, no! This is interesting, and not just to members (or former members) of NAWCC or AWI. Do tell us more -- with illustrations, please!Rudolf wrote:. . . . I have to stop myself at this point, this is NOT the NAWCC watch forum.
Sorry, gentlemen, for being a bit too overtly enthusiastic here . . . .
Dear RWS,
well, let's start with a decent Smith & Son Chronograph, early 1900s, made by Nicole, Nielsen (owned by R.B. North at that time) of Soho Square:
First, have a view of the perfectly balanced dial
The colour is off-white, a kind of cream which corresponds elegantly to the rose gold of the half hunter case. The hands have exactly the right length to touch the corresponding indications on the dial (most of the modern wrist watches, even the prolific ones, have too short hands). They are bold enough to read the time even in dim light yet the minute hand is finely sharpened to a point.
Note that all hands are made of gold because this watch is designed to be antimagnetic (there was a great fear of the influences of magnetism on watches fom the late 1880s to the early 1900s).
Please note the (hardly visible, sorry for the poor qualtiy) white alloy antimagnetic hairspring.
The barrel hosts a stronger mainspring so the barrel cover is raised (and, for decoration, engraved). The complete chronograph mechanism has been hidden underneath the dial (on the lower plate).
This is a decent watch to wear with a 3-pc pinstripe town suit, on a double Albert chain, because of the chronograph function (it indicates 1/5th of a second), probably even for the races (though for a DB grey morning coat vest I would recommend a slightly lighter half-hunter).
well, let's start with a decent Smith & Son Chronograph, early 1900s, made by Nicole, Nielsen (owned by R.B. North at that time) of Soho Square:
First, have a view of the perfectly balanced dial
The colour is off-white, a kind of cream which corresponds elegantly to the rose gold of the half hunter case. The hands have exactly the right length to touch the corresponding indications on the dial (most of the modern wrist watches, even the prolific ones, have too short hands). They are bold enough to read the time even in dim light yet the minute hand is finely sharpened to a point.
Note that all hands are made of gold because this watch is designed to be antimagnetic (there was a great fear of the influences of magnetism on watches fom the late 1880s to the early 1900s).
Please note the (hardly visible, sorry for the poor qualtiy) white alloy antimagnetic hairspring.
The barrel hosts a stronger mainspring so the barrel cover is raised (and, for decoration, engraved). The complete chronograph mechanism has been hidden underneath the dial (on the lower plate).
This is a decent watch to wear with a 3-pc pinstripe town suit, on a double Albert chain, because of the chronograph function (it indicates 1/5th of a second), probably even for the races (though for a DB grey morning coat vest I would recommend a slightly lighter half-hunter).
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BirdofSydney
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My beloved pocket watch (brushed steel) has recently left this earth. I am wondering whether to replace it, or invest in a decent wristwatch. I seldom wear a vest, owing to the heat here, which eliminates the most elegant manner of wearing a pocket watch anyway.
I wonder, what would a vintage pocket watch, not too big, nothing fancy, in rose gold be likely to set one back? Assuming I wanted it to work and all?
Best,
E
I wonder, what would a vintage pocket watch, not too big, nothing fancy, in rose gold be likely to set one back? Assuming I wanted it to work and all?
Best,
E
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le.gentleman
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Thanks Rudolf for those fantastic pics! I'd also like to get to know more about watches...
to AnthonyJordan: please check your private messages...
to AnthonyJordan: please check your private messages...
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Incroyable
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Hello Rudolf,
Yes, you are correct in saying that my watch has a movement with fausses-cotes and actually 17 jewels with temperature and isochronism. Quite a beautiful movement. The Haas Neveux company even merited a mention from Phillipe Dufour as one of his influences.
A rather obscure firm nowadays; akin to other defunct top-tier firms like CH Meylan, Paul Ditisheim pre-Solvil & Titus, and Jules Jurgensen. All of which are rather under-priced for their quality.
I am rather interested in your collection. And yes the English watches are all quite fascinting; I used to have a silver pair cased verge fusee, which was remarkably accurate for a relatively crude movement.
The photo is from 1963. Quite past the time when pocket watches were popular.
Yes, you are correct in saying that my watch has a movement with fausses-cotes and actually 17 jewels with temperature and isochronism. Quite a beautiful movement. The Haas Neveux company even merited a mention from Phillipe Dufour as one of his influences.
A rather obscure firm nowadays; akin to other defunct top-tier firms like CH Meylan, Paul Ditisheim pre-Solvil & Titus, and Jules Jurgensen. All of which are rather under-priced for their quality.
I am rather interested in your collection. And yes the English watches are all quite fascinting; I used to have a silver pair cased verge fusee, which was remarkably accurate for a relatively crude movement.
The photo is from 1963. Quite past the time when pocket watches were popular.
Dear BirdofSidney,
how can I ever properly answer this question? Similarly ask a automobile person for a decent green sports car, neither too fast nor too slow, and you will get a myriad of answers.
I will try my best by first of all narrowing down your specifications.
Let us assume you would like to buy a 12 size swiss open face rose gold watch (enamel dial, made in the 1910s), say by C. Meylan (top quality but not such a great name like Patek, Philippe or Louis Audemars) and you will pay in good condition about $ 1,200 to $ 1,500 - at a watch dealer, not a jeweler.
I think this is very good value compared to a new 14k wristwatch (try to cosult Jaeger Le Coutre's prices for a Reverso and you will pay - in 14 k - at least three times as much).
Well, of course, there are much cheaper PWs on the scene. I would recommend a 12 size Hamilton 900 or 920 (their best 12 size grade in 23 jewels) in 14 k and go up to $ 500-700. (Keystone) Howard's 12 size ser. 8 is equally recommendable, the highest grade came with 23 jewels, was beautifully finished and had very interesting dial and case varieties (well, most of them were yellow gold, I have to admit), slightly more expensive (though rarer). In general, I have made the observation that american 12 size watches are not as high in demand as Railroad Grade ones (16 or even 18 size only were admitted) .
Talking of english watches, a solid (oh, how I love those cases by F. Thoms!!!) open face in 18k (there was no 14k in England during the golden age of watchmaking) will range from $ 1,000 to $ 3,000. For this money, you will get a fine enamel dial (the best were made by Willis), a (preferably free-spung) top grade gilt frosted movement with a heavy gold screw balance and the best hairsprings in the world.
Check out http://www.antiquewatchstore.co.uk/ for a true connaisseur in english PWs, very realistic pricing and a gentleman-like first class service.
how can I ever properly answer this question? Similarly ask a automobile person for a decent green sports car, neither too fast nor too slow, and you will get a myriad of answers.
I will try my best by first of all narrowing down your specifications.
Let us assume you would like to buy a 12 size swiss open face rose gold watch (enamel dial, made in the 1910s), say by C. Meylan (top quality but not such a great name like Patek, Philippe or Louis Audemars) and you will pay in good condition about $ 1,200 to $ 1,500 - at a watch dealer, not a jeweler.
I think this is very good value compared to a new 14k wristwatch (try to cosult Jaeger Le Coutre's prices for a Reverso and you will pay - in 14 k - at least three times as much).
Well, of course, there are much cheaper PWs on the scene. I would recommend a 12 size Hamilton 900 or 920 (their best 12 size grade in 23 jewels) in 14 k and go up to $ 500-700. (Keystone) Howard's 12 size ser. 8 is equally recommendable, the highest grade came with 23 jewels, was beautifully finished and had very interesting dial and case varieties (well, most of them were yellow gold, I have to admit), slightly more expensive (though rarer). In general, I have made the observation that american 12 size watches are not as high in demand as Railroad Grade ones (16 or even 18 size only were admitted) .
Talking of english watches, a solid (oh, how I love those cases by F. Thoms!!!) open face in 18k (there was no 14k in England during the golden age of watchmaking) will range from $ 1,000 to $ 3,000. For this money, you will get a fine enamel dial (the best were made by Willis), a (preferably free-spung) top grade gilt frosted movement with a heavy gold screw balance and the best hairsprings in the world.
Check out http://www.antiquewatchstore.co.uk/ for a true connaisseur in english PWs, very realistic pricing and a gentleman-like first class service.
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Incroyable
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I feel pocket watches by some of the more obscure firms present a very fine value compared to a wristwatch of lower quality.
For example I once bought a CH Meylan Chronomtre grade size 12 OF watch in 18kt for a trifle of $700. One can only acquire a mid grade wristwatch in possibly 14kt or sometimes 9kt for that.
For example I once bought a CH Meylan Chronomtre grade size 12 OF watch in 18kt for a trifle of $700. One can only acquire a mid grade wristwatch in possibly 14kt or sometimes 9kt for that.
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