Button Stance and Gorge Line

What you always wanted to know about Elegance, but were afraid to ask!
hectorm
Posts: 1667
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2011 2:12 pm
Location: Washington DC
Contact:

Sun Feb 19, 2012 2:32 pm

Rowly wrote: A high gorge can make the lapel look short.
Rowly, I believe it's the opposite.
A high gorge (i.e. high notch level on your lapel) keeping the button stance constant, will make the lapel longer. A high button stance with an average gorge level is what it will make the lapel look short.
It may well be that you are using the term gorge not for the lapel notch level, but for the V area above the button stance.
On this subject I refer to the explanations given by Couch and Costi in the posts linked below

http://www.thelondonlounge.net/forum/vi ... rge#p33707
Rowly
Posts: 541
Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2009 2:42 pm
Contact:

Sun Feb 19, 2012 4:56 pm

Thanks for clearing this up
..A high gorge (i.e. high notch level on your lapel) keeping the button stance constant, will make the lapel longer. A high button stance with an average gorge level is what it will make the lapel look short.
It may well be that you are using the term gorge not for the lapel notch level, but for the V area above the button stance.
I was in fact, misusing the term gorge. Now we are agreed on the semantics..I would suggest that a high button stance without raising the gorge ( notch height) will make the lapel look short. On the other hand, if the button stance is on the high side raising the notch ( gorge) will give the illusion of a longer more elegant lapel...would you agree? I appreciate the clarification..could I ask , just to be very clear...does the term Gorge refer the finished level of the notch or, does it relate with more emphasis on the distance between the highest button and the notch?...thanks..Rowly..
hectorm
Posts: 1667
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2011 2:12 pm
Location: Washington DC
Contact:

Sun Feb 19, 2012 7:15 pm

Rowly wrote: I would suggest that a high button stance without raising the gorge ( notch height) will make the lapel look short. On the other hand, if the button stance is on the high side raising the notch ( gorge) will give the illusion of a longer more elegant lapel...would you agree?
Your suggestions are on the dot.
In the first case -high stance, relative low gorge- the look will (quoting Alden) "add 30 pounds to a scarecrow".
In the second case, raising the gorge not only will give the illusion of a longer lapel, in fact it will make it longer (and probably more elegant overall).
Rowly wrote: ...does the term Gorge refer the finished level of the notch or, does it relate with more emphasis on the distance between the highest button and the notch?
Gorge does not refer to the finished level of the notch but to the notch itself. The terms gorge level and notch level are the interchangeable ones.
The distance between the highest button and the notch is not the gorge but (assuming no roll to the second highest button) just a measure of the lapel length. The height of your gorge level is measured in relation to the shoulder seam and not to the stance (i.e. you could have a very highly placed gorge even with a very high stance and short lapel).
Rowly
Posts: 541
Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2009 2:42 pm
Contact:

Sun Feb 19, 2012 8:16 pm

hectorm ,Thank you for the detailed response. A clearly defined gorge is pleasing to the mind as well as to the eye!
hectorm
Posts: 1667
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2011 2:12 pm
Location: Washington DC
Contact:

Mon Feb 20, 2012 4:32 am

Ok, now that we agreed, let's discuss about the right notch level in a shawl collar dinner jacket. :)
Costi
Posts: 2963
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2005 6:29 pm
Location: Switzerland
Contact:

Mon Feb 20, 2012 7:08 am

:D
Chicken & egg question: is it a shawl collar or a shawl lapel?... :roll:
Some tailors are even capable of cutting it in one piece, without a seam in the back.
marburyvmadison
Posts: 136
Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2012 1:17 pm
Contact:

Tue Feb 21, 2012 4:14 am

Are there any books on suits that any of you'd recommend purchasing?

I was thinking of Bespoke: The men's style of Savile Row.
hectorm
Posts: 1667
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2011 2:12 pm
Location: Washington DC
Contact:

Tue Feb 21, 2012 4:25 am

Call it shawl collar or lapel, but seamless is -no doubt- the way to go in a bespoke DJ.
To end the "chicken & egg question" I propose that from now on we coin our own definition at the LL.
As follows: if the lapels are made in two pieces joined at the top, we should call it shawl lapels. If the collar is masterly done in only one piece, then we call it shawl collar. Agreed?
It might be inconsequential but it makes some sense to me.
hectorm
Posts: 1667
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2011 2:12 pm
Location: Washington DC
Contact:

Tue Feb 21, 2012 4:30 am

Costi wrote:
Chicken & egg question: is it a shawl collar or a shawl lapel?...
Some tailors are even capable of cutting it in one piece, without a seam in the back.
Call it shawl collar or lapel, but seamless is -no doubt- the way to go in a bespoke DJ.
To end the "chicken & egg question" I propose that from now on we coin our own definition at the LL. As follows: if the lapels are made in two pieces joined at the top, we should call it shawl lapels. If the collar is masterly done in only one piece, then we call it shawl collar. Agreed?
It might be inconsequential but it makes some sense to me.
Costi
Posts: 2963
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2005 6:29 pm
Location: Switzerland
Contact:

Tue Feb 21, 2012 6:57 am

It makes perfect sense, hectorm, I shawl remember this!
Post Reply
  • Information
  • Who is online

    Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests