storeynicholas wrote:I entirely agree, Costi: that ties are uncomfortable or too expensive is just nonsense. They are uncomfortable only if the collar doesn't fit or it isn't tied properly. As for the cost: I have ties that are probably 50 years old. I am sure that you are right that it is the social symbolism of the tie: the badge of the Great Oppressors, the rulers of the class system and so on that puts some people off. They need to hang a bit looser and so do their ties
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i disagree. it may be nonsense for you or for me but not for a a lot of people. we have suits made, so a $50-$90 tie is cheap and perhaps inconsequential by comparison (although i still find a $150 tie expensive, despite paying $400 for pants). But a $50-$90 tie is not cheap for everybody.
I worked with and have known a number (about a dozen im thinking of across the years) of younger men (under 30, and generally in non Finance and non-legal professions) in white collar jobs over the last decade, and they had limited clothing budgets. Their income levels wouldn't support much more (in NYC especially), but also they had other priorities in terms of allocating their disposable income (drinking and chasing girls seemed to be up there for more than a few of them). (And they were thrilled when they could find those awful square kenneth cole shoes on a clearance for $75!). Their wardrobes for work consisted of dockers, gap khakis, or in the case of one guy, Dickies and Carhartt work pants. Almost all of them wore only washable cotton pants as being both easier to deal with and cheaper, despite the fact that after 9 or 10 washes they looked pretty misshapen and faded. Most of them had 1 or at most 2 suits, and they only wore them to meetings outside the office (about once every 6-8 weeks) and they averaged 1-2 ties each, which i can recall more than one of them stating they got them at century 21 in NY, where most of the ties are under $30 and some of the real garbage is $9.99. They knew they were garbage but saw no reason to pay more.
And that was it.
They didnt want to spend any more money than that, both out of choice and out of limited budgets and they didn't really care for ties and found them a giant hassle and a waste of money. They generally thought that ties were stuffy and ridiculous, but at least conceded wearing a tie was necessary for a job interview.
Although there are plenty of 'hipsters' in NY wearing skinny suits with peg leg pants and skinny ties, that crowd is actually very small in number despite seeming large in the magazines, the TV shows, and the anecdotes---(similarly those men spending a lot of other money on fashion accessories are a small minority with the exxception of certain neighborhoods in Manhattan)--
they do not represent the bulk of regular men here --------and regular guys often cant be bothered- dont want to be bothered and don't want the expense. they dont want to take the time to learn
The whole 'rule of the opressor thing' is thinking that is 30 years out of date--- the shift to casual has allowed men who don't want the bother or expense --to be perfectly acceptable to msot people, even if your avergae person recognizes that there are times such attire really is inappropriate, most of the time in the work place people don't blink an eye, unless you come in in cut-off shorts!
Here's an semi-related anecdote:
And in fact, one of these gentlemen, who is now in his 30's and interviewing for jobs outside of NY, called me up last week and told me about his job interviewing experience. (I have given him a few career and wardrobe pointers over the years). He is interviewing for a mid-level financial analyst job, but far from wall street and not really dealing with many retail clients. He told me he wears a suit and tie (he only has 1 suit, and 2 spare blazers) to every meeeting and interview (although not all that great a suit) --and of the 8 or 9 companies he has been into, he has been the only one present in anything better than khakis, and in one office everyone was wearing sandals.
They never bothered to think WHY wear a tie and never considered it IN ITSELF, for its own merits - only as a social symbol (mostly negative, too). Once they understand, in my experience not only do they take up wearing ties, but they become collectors. 
