Hand-sewing

[h. richard]

In re-watching the BBC Savile Documentary I was intrigued by the discussion of hand-sewing. There seems to be a kind of intramural debate among tailors regarding which parts of a garment can be done just as well in the hands of a bespoke tailor using a sewing machine and other parts necessitating hand-sewing. I understand, for example, that the venerable A&S uses a machine in several parts of the garment. Other than the rather general observation that non-straight seams are better if hand-sewn, I wonder if anyone can provide more detailed information. In short, which parts of a garment should always be done by hand (settting the collar, sleeves, finishing buttonholes, etc. I presume); which parts are better if done by hand but can be done satisfactorily by machine; and in which parts, if any, does it make little if any difference? Why?

[old henry]

Just an example , if I may; In the Cesta Bros little tailor shop where I first apprenticed , the old gentlemen would apply all of the lapel facings by hand . No machine was used what-so-ever in the making of the lapels . This nearly forgotten method will easily take all day .This is how I learned, this is how I still choose to work. However , there are still old masters in New York making beautiful Facings by machine . Just as beautiful. A different look, but just as beautiful. F.Shattuck.

[h. richard]

Many thanks for the reply, Mr. Shattuck. What you describe is very interesting; it's a tribute to you and your commitment to craftsmanship that you keep such methods alive. Probably even many of your customers do not realize that you do this extra work.

It's probably impossible to put those differences into words but I hope at some point to be able to see firsthand what you're describing. In the meantime I will do some research to try to understand the elementary principles of how a lapel is constructed in general. It's not something I've ever seen done personally or even photos or drawings of the steps.

[Greger]

My granddad never used a sewing machine or any machine for clothes when it comes to the finest. Lesser tailors use machines. The problem to day is not many tailors know how to use a needle and thimble like the old masters. A few years ago some tailors were showing their crooked stitches as a sign of quality because their crooked stitches were clearly not machined. The old masters would never let out a garment with crooked stitches (grinning stitches or crooked teeth). Their stitches were dead straight. When that is the only kind of sewing one does then one gets pretty good at it. Most of these guys started pretty small, like two to seven years old. The cut off age was five for granddad, six and older, "We don't know you", So my granddad said, "Six and older the hands are unteachable". Plus, when the young person needed to earn his own way he had all of those years to develop professional skill and be fast enough. There are some people who have a knack for it and can learn at any age. Learning how to hold and handle the cloth and use a needle and thimble and manipulate the layers of cloth, as with any skill there are certain ways of doing it that is best, and these skills were passed down. The advantage of the sewing machine is that it is quick, but the stitches are not supple or pliable and are more rigid, so less comfortable, which is why those tailors that used them were called, by some, lesser tailors. I hear factories have better machines, but few tailors can pay for them. Factory work is not custom, so does not deal with the shape of your body, but are generic garments. Tailoring is interesting. Every body is different. It is a treat to find a tailor that has the old learning.

[old henry]

I like what you say very much. In the shop where I learned to sew by hand the clock ticked much slower. The suits they made would be worn for years and years, so it was natural and we didn't have a second thought about dedicating a day to apply the lapel facings by hand. My Grandfather wore these suits for 40 years. His pattern from the 1930s still hung in the shop when I worked there. This is why I do not work in Manhattan - the clock spins too fast. Also, knowing how to hold the cloth in hand is as important as knowing how to hold the needle and use the thimble.

Frank Shattuck

[old henry]

Many thanks for the reply, Mr. Shattuck. What you describe is very interesting; it's a tribute to you and your commitment to craftsmanship that you keep such methods alive. Probably even many of your customers do not realize that you do this extra work.

It's probably impossible to put those differences into words but I hope at some point to be able to see firsthand what you're describing. In the meantime I will do some research to try to understand the elementary principles of how a lapel is constructed in general. It's not something I've ever seen done personally or even photos or drawings of the steps.

If you like I will photograph the process and send to you.

[alden]

I vividly remember a scene when I met my old Sicilian tailor for the first time, a man who started as a child to sew and had six decades experience in the craft. I asked him about hand sewing and he looked at me not understanding and said "I am a tailor. I do everything by hand."

Michael Alden

[alden]

If you like I will photograph the process and send to you.

Frank,

Please do photograph it and then we will post the pictures here in the Bespoke forum for all to see. And when I come to NY someday, we can video the process..."Action!".....Cut!

Michael

[old henry]

I will be cutting a suit next week .I will see if I can talk my customer into a peak lapel, as this , when done by hand, is most satisfying to the tailor.. I will also photograph the of laying the tape as this is a part of the process.

[h. richard]

This sounds great. I'd love to see the photos!

[old henry]

Dear H.Richard,

I will be cutting a coat from H.Lesser 7-1/2oz cloth very soon. I will photograph the hand facing process and ask Michael to post them for you. For this Gentleman I will also be making a pleated hem which is also very old world. I do not think many people have seen this. It is very time consuming. I will photograph this also. I am working a 16oz at this time, but the lighter weight is the true test of the tailors hand. I am really looking forward to this project ..

F.Shattuck..

[old henry]

Yesterday I basted and hand stitched the shoulders for a Henry Stewart shoulder. Gathering the proper fullness. This shoulder is a bit different than a regular shoulder. A much stronger look. I think it might be along the lines of a Caraceni Roma shoulder. A 57th St Shoulder. More volume is needed for a larger pad. So I also needed to make a new top sleeve to fit the new armhole without “up pulling” or “cross pulling”. So I made a muslin sleeve to test the new pattern. . My new top sleeve pattern was not cross pulling but it was up pulling. So I adjusted it accordingly and will cut and make the sleeves and set (baste) them today. An all day job. If they go right in (which they may ) may also hand stitch them today. But I’ll probably go catch some lake trout as it’s a beautiful north wind.
Making and setting beautifully a pair of sleeves is a great accomplishment for one day.
Because of the sturdy cloth I use, and the fact that my suits fit and function without pulling, my suits will last many many years. So why not take a day to make beautiful sleeves. And a day to apply the facings beautifully and authenticity by hand. Take the time for the charming old work.
ps. This top sleeve pattern must also be adjusted for a rope sleeve

[Melcombe]

Frank, excuse my ignorance in these matters, but will a more voluminous shoulder (& upper sleeve) typically have a more dramatic taper down the length of the sleeve to the cuff? or will the cuff itself be 'looser'?

It's a personal observation (and probably wrong, (as I will not wear glasses 'though I should) but when I see examples of 'drape'-ish (A&S?) cut, the cuff appears snug and thereby seems to pull the shoulder with it when moving the arm. I presume that without that, the sleeve will simply pull up with movement? Or is this apparent effect more the result of tighter armholes?

ps - It's all the fault of this forum ( ) that I can't now judge someones suit unless I see the collar staying put while theyre moving about in it..

pps - And what are you catching those trout on?

[old henry]

, Melcomb, I love your questions as it keeps Old world methods and knowledge in the forefront and helps to separate the used Bentley salesmen from the sacred craft. It helps to separate the used Bentley salesmen from Moi 😂😂( a loosing battle I know )
So this sleeve I’m making now is a rope sleeve so it needs more volume around the top sleeve. AND the shoulder points have been raised 1/2” front 1/2” back for a larger pad so even more sleeve crown is needed. And I don’t know how it can be seamed but by hand.
I remember my great old pal Tony Farelli and the day he showed the proper way to do give volume to the top sleeve ( that’s my term - volume ) Every time I do this adjustment I think of Tony Farelli. He made some of Ralph Lauren first patterns in I think Lawrence Mass.
This coat I’m making is a highly tailored , strong suit. Not breezy or flowing. A 57th St Henry Stewart suit. A very classy top notch customer asked if I would do it for him. Of course. I’m honored.
This cut is not a drape cut. Highly tailored. Often on a drape cut ,the armhole is made “easy” for more comfort. “Easy” meaning roomy. Big. Of course as we all know on here this is incorrect. It is why everything pulls this a way and that when you reach for something. Some drape suits , especially 1940s -50s had big sleeves all the way down.
The original drape had drape in the chest and back but it had a fitted ,well placed armhole. It also had a trim fitted sleeve. Nobody makes the original drape anymore. The original drape is the only drape I like. I made one for manton long ago.
As fot trout.
Up here on Lake Ontario we get 25 - 30 pound lake trout or smaller brown trout now- 15 to 20 lbs. The salmon will be gathering to come in soon. When customers come they often book a charter. Big thrill and good workout pulling one in. I didn’t go today. I got rolling on the sleeves.
☘️☘️☘️

[old henry]

Yesterday i made a second muslin sleeve from the adjusted top sleeve pattern just to be able to cut with confidence. A 57th street shoulder/ rope sleeve is very tricky to be—— elegant and without aggravation. The new muslin fit like a dream. So I cut and prepared the sleeves and will set them today. Pure sacred craft. No bullshit here. No glorified MTM. Honored work only.
F