Balint

[Guest]

Can anyone comment on this Austrian maker of bespoke and RTW shoes? He measures the shoes in Vienna but they are manufactured in Romania (Tirgu Secuiesc). I wonder if the RTW shoes are available in Romania and at what price.

[RWS]

His still-incomplete website, http://www.balint.at , is in good German (though Lajos Balint is a Magyar name) and decent English. It indicates that Herr Balint is an orthopod and his shoes orthopaedically sound. The few models displayed look less Mitteleuropaeisch than Vass or Kielman but certainly aren't Green's or Alden's in styling. I found little indication of quality of construction but may hope that some fellow Lounger has worn Herr Balint's shoes.

[bengal-stripe]

The Austrian shoe company Saint Crispin also has their shoes produced in Rumania, in Brasov (German name Kronstadt) in Transylvania (just down the road from Targu Secuiesc). Maybe there is a long tradition of shoemaking in this area. After all Transylvania was Austro/Hungarian before WW 1 and still has many ethnic Magyars among its population.
http://www.saint-crispins.com/

I’ve never seen any Saint-Crispin shoes and can’t comment on their quality, but the website is exceptional and a brilliant example of clarity and information (unlike some other pretentious shoe sites I could mention).

Prescribed reading for anyone interested in shoes.

[Guest]

Saint Crispins are extremely open both on their web site and in the reply I was sent to my inquiry. While their bespoke prices are reasonable ($1850 dollars for first pair), their prices for RWT are stratospheric, 840 dollars per pair. For Romanian-manufactured shoes, this is over-the-top.

[jcusey]

Saint Crispins are extremely open both on their web site and in the reply I was sent to my inquiry. While their bespoke prices are reasonable ($1850 dollars for first pair), their prices for RWT are stratospheric, 840 dollars per pair. For Romanian-manufactured shoes, this is over-the-top.

Considering the fact that their Pret shoes are made by hand (and I mean "made" in the sense that it's used by English shoemakers), $840 doesn't seem unreasonable. More than 20 hours of skilled labor costs money, even if it's done in Eastern Europe.

[RWS]

Wouldn't the reasonableness of the high prices depend chiefly upon the excellence of construction (as quality of design is a question of aesthetics)? And no Lounger, it seems, has examined let alone worn a pair of Saint Crispins.

After John's clear, compelling summary on AAAC of the fine points of Vass's construction, I wonder whether any other shoemaker (at least in eastern Europe) offers a better-made shoe.

[Guest]

I know some people are touchy about the subject of prices and fairness. While someone like myself is less interested in process rather than product, of course one would have to examine the shoes to evaluate them. However, given that most people on the forums say that EG makes the best men's RTW shoes in the world, and Saint Crispin's is charging about the same prices without their reputation and the shoes are manufactured in Romania, the price still seems out of wack.

This is the reply from Crispin's, and I have to say, the guy writing impresses the hell out of me, consistant with the remarks about his web site:

"sorry to disappoint you with our prices. JL is a far more industrialized product though very well made. Just the former EG factory which is now owned by JL would have to produce at least 170 pairs every day to be profitable. Lattanzi, if they still produce in their typical semi handmade "Bologna" method should make at least 30 pairs per day. We make currently 90 pairs a month, PRET and BESPOKE together.

We are a workshop of ten employees and our shoes are strictly made by shoemakers sitting on a bench and using hand tools. No short cuts, no compromizes. Our goal is to make the best and most beautiful shoes for our customers. Though the actual costs of labour are lower then in the EC we have many additional costs and efforts to run such an operation in Rumania which a company like Lattanzi don't have. Without our young, highly motivated, well trained Rumanians a unique shoe as ours would not exist.

Hope to have been informative and not too entusiastic.

Best regards

Michael Rollig

PS. Prices remain the same in Rumania and Vienna."

That said, how much does Vass RTW cost if ordered from Budapest? Also, does anyone know where these are offered for sale at present?

[Guest]

Can I add Kielman, Kaminski (Warsaw), Herzog (Maribor), and Kovacs (Budapest) to my query? What are their RTW prices and availability?

[jcusey]

Wouldn't the reasonableness of the high prices depend chiefly upon the excellence of construction (as quality of design is a question of aesthetics)? And no Lounger, it seems, has examined let alone worn a pair of Saint Crispins.

I know of one Lounger who has seen the shoes, although he hasn't posted in this thread yet. His comment to me several months ago was that he found them to be clunky and inelegant. Given some of the sole treatments that they offer on their RTW shoes and the toe bump on the 1746 last that they apparently use on all of their RTW shoes, I can see how he came to that conclusion.

Nevertheless, your point is well-taken. It's more than a bit idle for us to speculate on the value of a pair of St. Crispins RTW shoes when none of us have seen them in person. All I can say is that I like what I read on the website: Herr Rollig seems to understand what it takes to produce a quality hand-made shoe, and he seems to be dedicated to doing it. If this is so, $840 does not seem at all unreasonable, provided that the aesthetics are what I'm looking for.

And a point about EG RTW shoes: they're wonderful, as I think just about everbody here would agree. The lasts are typically beautiful and well-fitting, the materials first-rate, the quality control excellent, and the finishing superb. They're not handmade, though, and comparing them to handmade shoes, particularly those made with an Austro-Hungarian aesthetic, is a bit like comparing apples to oranges.

After John's clear, compelling summary on AAAC of the fine points of Vass's construction, I wonder whether any other shoemaker (at least in eastern Europe) offers a better-made shoe.

I don't think that there's any secret about what it takes to produce first-rate handmade RTW shoes. The problem is in finding or training artisans who have the talent and the disposition to make them. It's not easy work. I believe Vass's quality of construction to be first-rate, but they hardly have a monopoly on first-rate shoe construction. It would not surprise me if other eastern European makers offer a similar quality of construction, although I really don't know.