The London Lounge

Good day all,

I have a particular question about the above topic, which I thought may serve as a useful springboard for discussing this much-maligned style, which is nonetheless a personal favourite of mine.

I have recently acquired a specimen of same, admittedly RTW, but of the highest order (Finamore Napoli). It has a beautifully striped body of white and two shades of blue, a collar which is nicer and fits and flatters me better than I ever thought possible and...barrel cuffs.

Herein, predictably, lies the dilemma to which I refer. This is not the first Neapolitan shirt I have come across with contrasting barrel cuffs, it will not be the last, I'm sure. Both the frequency with which I've seen them, and the provenance of firms such as Finamore Napoli (no Gianni-come-lately, to borrow an excellent turn of phrase I picked up here), makes me reluctant to dismiss the style out-of-hand.

I generally prefer French cuffs in virtually all cases, but this specimen was too nice to pass up. The thought of having the cuffs replaced crossed my mind, but may prove unsatisfactory, and seems unnecessary. The shirt, worn with suit and tie, does not look out of place.

I recalled my contribution to a debate of the use of button-down collars with businesswear some time ago, which in brief was the proposal that it is the heritage of the style, and not its inherent design features, which make it "casual" rather than "formal" (though admittedly, this heritage informs the styling of most button-downs, so that their materials and cut tend toward the casual end of the spectrum).

I wondered whether the answer lay in this direction: specifically in Anglo-American preconceptions based on the historic usage of contrast-collar shirts (specifically detachable stiff collars), which is either absent (unlikely) or less influential and/or more mutable in Italy (more likely). There is also, frustratingly but inescapably, the association in Western popular culture of the style with plutocratic business and finance types - spearheaded by the film Wall Street and its real life imitators - which put some people off wearing the style entirely. Although similar factors, I note, have not dissuaded anyone in our community from wearing braces, to my knowledge.

I myself am very fond of the contrast-collar shirt, as it allows me to wear a cloth that is on the bolder side of my taste spectrum, but not to overwhelm the more restrained ties which I prefer. The white collar does frame one's face rather nicely, it also provides a visual link back to the white linen pocket square when one is wearing a coloured/striped shirt.

So, to summarise, I am both wondering about my fellow Loungers' views on wearing the shirt which I have purchased, and the usage of the style in general, and the rationale behind such views and potential cultural factors influencing same.

Kind regards,


EB

if you like it, wear it

I agree with Eddie. If you like it, wear it. Don't overthink the situation -- it is just a shirt.

I concur with Bry and Eddie.

An alternative, depending on how the placket is made, the diameter of the cuff, and your access to someone who could match the finish on the buttonholes, would be to remove the cuff button, cut a second buttonhole to replace it, and turn it into a single-link cuff as in a full-dress shirt.

I don’t mean to antagonize the posters above but if the advice and views we can glean from LL are “if you like it, wear it” then what’s the point? Any schmuck down at the mall could tell you that, ne c’est pas?

Back to topic: I agree with Mr Hayes that contrasting-cuffs/collar shirts have acquired an undeservedly unsavoury reputation.

Besides the cinematic/City wide boy image, I think this stems from some rather poor choices in fabric (for the non-white portion) that are often seen in these shirts.

Regarding the cuffs, I would merely point out that double cuffs are very rarely worn in Italy. Indeed, they border on dandyism/foppery, among average or even sartorially interested Italians. I’m not surprised, therefore, that your shirt sports single cuffs.

I would say that if it fits well and wears well there is nothing to be worried about / ashamed of from the cuff standpoint.

I don't hate contrast collar shirts, though I don't wear them much either. To me they are not so much "Wall Street" as they are "Iacocca!" Still, I like them from time to time.

I would not, however, ever wear a contrast colar shirt with button cuffs. That's just a style faux pas. Breaking the rules is great when it results is superior elegance, but this breakage does not, IMO.

I do try to be a follower of rules that Manton provides, since my personal exposure to rules is virtually vicarious in nature.

My executive shirts, which are those to be worn with executive suits, are invariably made from smooth-weave broadcloth. Long-sleeves, pocketless, if the cloth is not white, the collars and cuffs are white. Collars are without buttons while cuffs are French. Not knowing what else is the rule (but see last sentence below), the front buttons can be plainly seen as there is no French front (placket?).

My non-executive shirts have chest pockets, usually made of Oxford cloth and do not have contrast collars and cuff;s;. Collars may have buttons, but cuffs are compact with buttons. If collars have buttons, a French front hides the front shirt buttons under a placket. Otherwise, the front shirt buttons will be seen on top of a placket.

The collar button/shirt front French front relationship sort of follows those of Brooks Brothers' shirts.

I am a big fan of the white cutaway collar in a Canclini Royal poplin on a coloured body, but never want the cuffs in white as well - What the general opinion on white as a collar only?

ethandesu wrote:I am a big fan of the white cutaway collar in a Canclini Royal poplin on a coloured body, but never want the cuffs in white as well - What the general opinion on white as a collar only?

I like it and, for most purposes, actually prefer it.

ethandesu wrote:
I am a big fan of the white cutaway collar in a Canclini Royal poplin on a coloured body, but never want the cuffs in white as well - What the general opinion on white as a collar only?
.

British dress code largely prefers only contrast collar in white with cuffs in the same colour of the shirt body, as demonstrated by looking at POW Charles when he is wearing contrast collar shirtts.
In addition as contrast collar shirts look a bit overdressy , barrel cuffs in my opinion seem preferable to french ones in order to mitigate the final outlook

Colored body, white collar and white turnback cuffs for me please.

These items result from repairs, only, for me and I usually get the cuffs and collars replaced at the same time. If I were getting the work done on a shirt I knew would only get worn with a blazer (the only sportcoat I ever wear a white collared shirt with) I might consider barrel cuffs. But so far, it has always been double cuffs.

I get my shirts (bespoke, New & Lingwood) with two, own colour (stripes, stripes, stripes....), detachable collars each. Consequently, I have two white collars; they came with a never-worn white shirt, which, as I reflect, is really kept in reserve for funerals and other occasions (morning suit?) when only white will do. I often think of putting on one of my white collars with a striped shirt, but somehow never do, perhaps because it would add an extra "pattern" (plain white) to one set of stripes (shirt), more often than not another set of stripes (suit), spots of some kind (tie and pocket hndkerchief) and cufflinks. Things quickly get too complicated for my senescent brain.

Frog in Suit

Oops...just had a look at this Summer's Brooks Bros catalogue and realised my casual shirts with collar buttons have front shirt buttons which show over the placket.

Checked my wardrobe and the shirts with front buttons concealed underneath the placket are those with the modern rounded short upstanding collars. I like to wear these when I'm in the more colourful Indian or Arab/Pakistani/Muslim environment when I also add a "bejeweled" button cover to the neck button.

HappyStroller wrote: ...<snipped>...
My non-executive shirts have chest pockets, usually made of Oxford cloth and do not have contrast collars and cuff;s;. Collars may have buttons, but cuffs are compact with buttons. If collars have buttons, a French front hides the front shirt buttons under a placket. Otherwise, the front shirt buttons will be seen on top of a placket.

The collar button/shirt front French front relationship sort of follows those of Brooks Brothers' shirts.

Austin Reed (ok, ok... we can't always avoid the middle market... ) this spring has a nice contrasting collar shirt with the 'body' in a dark blue over white bengal stripe. The cuffs are single but the collar has a nice, 20s-style rounded point.

Should look good with a good blazer/trousers and either a tie or open-necked.