The London Lounge

I have decided to bespeak two POW suits. One with blue overcheck, and one with a red check. I like what I have seen in the P& B Universal book ( 74143, and 74142 ). However, before I decide...the same patterns are available in the Dugdale books...and in the Fisher Royal Classic book. What are the pros and cons of theese cloths? Apart from the usual trade off between weight and finish, there is also the dryness ( assuming a milled finish, or dry finish will reflect less light and not look so washed out in daylight?)
All help and experiences welcome, as usual. Thanks, Rowly

Hi Rowly,

If you're considering flannel as one of the materials I encourage you to try and see some of the Fox Flannels. This one in particular stands out for me which I have yet to make up, but probably will for next Fall. I love how there's a hint of red in the borders of the checks. This is a 10/11 oz worsted flannel that almost feels like a woolen due to its fuzzy softness.

Thanks Slewfoot, It is a big help to see a larger piece of cloth...where the pattern is more identifiable. Have you a ref for this cloth? I know the Fox flannels have a great reputation....I was also wondering if a worsted with a milled finish would hold a crease better, and look as good? thanks, Rowly.

Rowly

It’s very hard to give concrete advice without knowing the state of your wardrobe and your exact needs.

The fragile, lightweight Fox flannel would be a great accent piece to an established wardrobe. If you are doing things right, it would not get more than 20 wears a year.

If you building a wardrobe, then a PoW in a solid worsted is a better buy. You should include a look at H. Lesser, and Smith Woolens books.

Do you not have access to the distributors books?

Michael

You could also browse the catalogue of Dugdale Brothers. They recently changed their website, so you now need to create an account, but I have only good experiences with them.

Michael, I have access to the Dugdale, Fisher and Universal books. I only get to see the Lesser and Smiths books on my trips to London. Both Lesser and Smith have been very good at sending me swatches in the past, but selecting from small swatches has been hit and miss with me. I realize that preference can be subjective and very specific queries are less likely to get many responses. However, I am building my wardrobe and for now I prefer worsteds to flannels.(I still have some rtw. flannels left for the time being.) The patterns I like are not available from Smiths or Lessers. Let's assume I only want the pow with red overcheck, then it's between the Dugdale ( Milled finish...flannel look-a-like ) The Fisher ( Similar but super 100's and around 13oz ( perhaps a better finish?)...and PB Universal ( a heavier weight..but I have no experience of this cloth ).....I have learnt a lot from your advocation of ,'Cloth with character', such as the rougher sharkskins from Smiths at the heavier weights. For this reason, I am drawn to the P&B cloth (74142). It seems to me to have a very dry almost tweedy look to it which I find appealing. The only thing is that other cloths I have seen in that book seem rough and unrefined to me. I have noted that many swear by the P&B book...wheras, it seems that the Dugdale are more respected simply on the basis of being very good value for the price. Given that the patterns are the same, I suppose it's going to be a decision based on the merits of theese three cloth qualities...perhaps, one's as good as the next?....Any further advice.?....Thanks again, Rowly

Michael:

How does the heavier woolen Fox flannel hold up?

I'm not a fan of lightweight woolen flannel. Creases and doesn't drape very well.

C

A while ago, I had a similar decision choosing between the P&B and Dugdale PoW cloths. My decision was finally swayed by the heavier weight of the P&B cloth, the blue windowpane pattern is a little bolder than the rather faint windowpane on the Dugdale cloth and finally, I was looking for a PoW cloth with a little surface nap whereas the Dugdale one is smoother finished.

Edwin DeBoise made up a lovely d/b suit in P&B cloth #74143 for me. The d/b coat drapes very nicely, easily holding its shape after a long day's wear and the trousers hangs straight down without the breaks in the leg-line that you sometimes get with lighter weight cloths. If you bump into Edwin, ask him what another esteemed SR tailor said to him about my suit...

- C

Thanks Cdo, That is very helpful advice. I may well follow your lead. I feel the #74143 might make a nice B2 2 pce with notched lapels..the stronger blue in the check will sway my choice. The #74142, with the red overcheck suggests to me a db..or.... possibly a B2 with 2 slanted pockets and peaked lapels..and maybe even a 3 pce. at that. It will be a chance to experience this cloth and weight. Would I be correct in thinking that the PB has richer tones and is less pale than the Dugdales? I am delighted you are pleased with your suit..I can feel the excitment building ! Rowly.

Unfortunately, I threw out the Dugdale PoW swatch but my recollection was that I preferred the P&B because I thought the glencheck was a tad bolder and the houndstooth part of the pattern was coarser. I wanted the PoW suit to be sportier-looking to wear when days were more relaxed without serious meetings with clients and the board. P&B #74143 is a bold pattern (for work, rightly or wrongly) when looking at it close up but even at short distances away, it takes on a more silvery, salt-and-pepper appearance. I am also tempted by P&B #74142 with its lovely burgundy red windowpane but too many other projects are further up the queue!

- C

This is exactly what I want to hear ! Silvery...salt and pepper . I feel that this is a sporty suit, wearable in the country or after hours. However, I too will want to wear it for less serious meetings. I think it allows a bit more self expression and is not just another business suit. I'm glad the pattern is a bit more visible. I was concerned that the Dugdales might look a bit nondescript.
Thanks again for the advice and encouragement., Rowly.