Good shirtmaker in UK

[Costi]

There is live music.
Then there are recordings of various degrees of quality. And then there are MIDI renditions. It is a matter of discernment and individual sensitivity to differences. There are people to whom this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FgngDWkvdzE

is the same as this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RHAO_kwC6MM

And people who sense some kind of difference, but are perfectly happy with the former just as well.
But we are talking about clothes, some might argue. So yes, some people also have such ON/OFF buttons in their heads that make them sensitive to the finest hues when talking about apples and become colour-blind when talking about grapes.
Then there is the subject of marginal utility: is the extra price worth the difference in quality? In this case I believe it is fair to admit the difference and decide one can live without it (but one would like to have it in a perfect world), or that it is simply unaffordable, rather than deny it altogether.
This result-oriented thinking, in which one doesn't care for the process as long as the result corresponds to some predetermined "target", does nothing but artificially separate the outcome from the process, when they are in fact intimately connected. It de-humanizes lots of things in our lives - from work relationships to shopping choices.
Of course we can get custom-made shirts that fit us reasonably well from a factory or from a craftsman. They will both have their limits and their quirks, none of the two processes produces perfection (and who would want it, really?). However, what I personally appreciate and pay for is a custom-made shirt that has the human touch. If I am to put up with limits and quirks anyway, I prefer them to be human ones rather than computer ones. To me, the difference is discernible. I am not interested ONLY in the result - but in process that produces it, too. From my point of view, this is the only way to really appreciate the result, too - not by comparing it to the result of other processes (pears are nicer than apples), but by relating it to the process itself.

[Rowly]

However, what I personally appreciate and pay for is a custom-made shirt that has the human touch. If I am to put up with limits and quirks anyway, I prefer them to be human ones rather than computer ones. To me, the difference is discernible. I am not interested ONLY in the result - but in process that produces it, too. From my point of view, this is the only way to really appreciate the result, too - not by comparing it to the result of other processes (pears are nicer than apples), but by relating it to the process itself.

Very well put !

[NJS]

Yes, Costi, I agree with all of that; with the slight reservation that I think that there is a tendency these days to condescend to far too great a degree of specificity in relation to the methods of production of things. A horseman wants a great horse but (beyond knowing that it is sound), he is hardly going to want to know about its internal anatomy. There is also the point that a factory-cut shirt might be indistinguishable from a shop-cut shirt and let us even say that they are practically identical but the makers are passing the cheaper version off as though it were the costlier version and that is objectionable. It is even more objectionable when the factory-cut shirt is below par for a shop-cut shirt. I mean, it is not just the pattern-cutting that is important but the actual cloth cutting by the expert cutter - this is why firms' cutters are so proud of their positions; because hands and shears on cloth, they compete with each other over their expertise in the cut of the cloth.
NJS

[st.tully]

Well, I must be the luckiest fellow - Budd rtw fits me absolutely perfect but for a quarter inch adjustment on the right sleeve. Mr. Rowley and Mr. Butcher agree hat I have perfect Budd body shape. "We cut for men not boys" says Rowley. Although my doctor suggests a loose a stone, I prefer Budd's advice to "hold steady".

I have always found the fellows at Budd to be helpful and of good cheer. Of course, I do not waste their time and in return they don't waste mine.

[Rowly]

I share your good luck and your pleasant experiences !

[gegarrenton]

Although my doctor suggests a loose a stone, I prefer Budd's advice to "hold steady".

I think I would lean to the medical professional's opinion over the shirtmaker regarding health!

[Julian]

An update...

After having participated fairly vigorously in the recent discussion on this thread regarding Turnbull & Asser's use of technology in its bespoke shirtmaking operation I finally found myself with some time to spare in London yesterday to visit shirtmakers. I'd already visited T&A's bespoke shop a month or two ago so I took the opportunity to visit the other candidate on my shortlist, namely Robert Whittaker (RW) at Dege & Skinner. From what I've read he has a good reputation and his shirts are made on the premises although, when I checked this with him, he was very honest in clarifying that there were also a couple of people who are outworkers rather than based in the premises; in any event there is definitely no factory or overseas outsourcing involved.

My concern with RW, completely unsubstantiated by evidence, was that his focus would be almost entirely on business shirts and so the range of fabrics, collar styles, etc that I might want to explore for casual shirts (which is all that I'm interested in) would be limited or non-existent. My visit reassured me on that score. We had a fantastic discussion on various fabrics and I've decided that my next venture into bespoke shirts will be with RW. RW also has a 4 shirt minimum first order rather than the 6 shirt minimum required by T&A so, if things don't go as planned, it will be a cheaper experiment. I hope to get back in next week to get measured and I'll let people know how it's goes once I get my first shirt.

Now, if only my choice for where to go for my next sports coat was so simple...

- Julian

[Scot]

Julian,

Robert is a gent and, in my opinion, a very good shirtmaker. I am delighted with the shirts he has made for me and, despite some reports to the contrary, with the service received from Dege. I hope you enjoy the same experience.

[Rob O]

Best of luck with that commission...and may I recommend Steven Hitchcock for your next sport coat. He's a master

[internationalist]

Sorry, maybe trivial question but how many visits are usual/recommended with the artisan?

As I read some of you do it completely online. Hm. Who can you recommend as a first shirt (http://www.thelondonlounge.net/forum/vi ... =4&t=11070) and good value? Wherever post is delivered or Ryanair flies, not necessarily in the UK.