Does it make sense to persist after an indifferent result?

[hectorm]

Thank you, once again, Alexandra. Your candid breakdown of costs and prices comes to no surprise but it´s extremely helpful in understanding the very basics of the industry (from a customer point of view).
There are many nuances and considerations that could be extracted from those figures.
I just want to pick up the fact that the basic cost of Fabric plus Manufacturing of your caban coat comes up to 150 euros. At the same time Fabric and Manufacturing cost of a "similar" bespoke peacoat at Gieves & Hawkes (known costs of melton wool and 40-50 hours of mostly handwork) would be around 1700-2000 euros. The ratio is 12 to one or more.
Meanwhile the retailer price of the caban coat is 937 euros and the SR customer pays 3000 euros for his G&H peacoat. The ratio radically dropped to 3 to one, which makes relatively much more attractive (just price wise) the bespoke option. Or.... just wait for the sale.

[lxlloyd]

Thank you, once again, Alexandra. Your candid breakdown of costs and prices comes to no surprise but it´s extremely helpful in understanding the very basics of the industry (from a customer point of view).
There are many nuances and considerations that could be extracted from those figures.
I just want to pick up the fact that the basic cost of Fabric plus Manufacturing of your caban coat comes up to 150 euros. At the same time Fabric and Manufacturing cost of a "similar" bespoke peacoat at Gieves & Hawkes (known costs of melton wool and 40-50 hours of mostly handwork) would be around 1700-2000 euros. The ratio is 12 to one or more.
Meanwhile the retailer price of the caban coat is 937 euros and the SR customer pays 3000 euros for his G&H peacoat. The ratio radically dropped to 3 to one, which makes relatively much more attractive (just price wise) the bespoke option. Or.... just wait for the sale.

In this case you have to thank my boss's business philosophy! It often takes many hours of persuasion for the fabric manufacturers to permit us to reveal the costs of their materials and the textiles' origins. The garment manufacturers even have to detail their cutting/ironing/assembly time/how many workers they have/who owns them to be available.

As you were detailing, indeed, Savile row bespoke is staggering value for money... especially when considered against the price of womenswear in the equivalent hierarchy of the market (the handworked haute couture, but even the Pret a porter lines).

I know that in most luxury PAP womenswear, there's a higher markup for costprice to wholesale to retail. (I was shown the old books from certain companies that LVMH and kering would come after me with snipers if i shared).

[uppercase]

Very nice posts ixlloyd! Thanks.

[hectorm]

As you were detailing, indeed, Savile row bespoke is staggering value for money... especially when considered against the price of womenswear in the equivalent hierarchy of the market (even the Pret a porter lines).

I´ll clip this quote and stick it to my dear wife´s vanity mirror. Coming from you, it will make a diference.

[davidhuh]

As you were detailing, indeed, Savile row bespoke is staggering value for money... especially when considered against the price of womenswear in the equivalent hierarchy of the market (even the Pret a porter lines).

I´ll clip this quote and stick it to my dear wife´s vanity mirror. Coming from you, it will make a diference.

[lxlloyd]

As you were detailing, indeed, Savile row bespoke is staggering value for money... especially when considered against the price of womenswear in the equivalent hierarchy of the market (even the Pret a porter lines).

I´ll clip this quote and stick it to my dear wife´s vanity mirror. Coming from you, it will make a diference.

I suggest you do that whilst leaving a nice shoe box at the bottom of the mirror. She does know where you sleep, after all.

[Luca]

I wanted to thank the various posters for their well-intentioned advice and offer a couple of responses and a little update.
- I appreciate that different prices can reflect different input of time/value. As a responsible pater familiae, I also have to try to optimise the ratio between quality and outlay. The more successful commission ended up being discounted due to a contretemp on their part but normally we’re talking about 1100-1200 GBP for a 2-piece suit. It may seem a pittance to some, but not to this salaryman. Extras (2nd pair of trousers, waistcoat) are also priced fairly “punchily”.
- That said, after some wearing of both, the successful MtM suit is a delight to wear while the unsuccessful one seems less comfortable each time. It might be psychological but it does seem a real shame; lovely fabric, too.
- Rather chastened and with some apprehension (but also needing another good ‘client’ suit), I am approaching another commission and will be taking the high road, rather than the low.

[Luca]

A couple of pics of the aforementioned MtM commission which, despite the very nice PoW fabric, has felt definitely constricted in fit around the thighs and back.

[Frederic Leighton]

Luca, thank you for sharing these photos and describing your experience with MTM. I'm sorry to hear it didn't really work out the way you hoped. Did you ever ask the company to fix the problems, like other members suggested before? at least they could cut a new pair of trousers to limit your disappointment; that doesn't seem unreasonable to ask (and to expect) at all.

You wear the club collar you were looking for some time ago (I remember your post in the LL). Did you manage to find the right thing for you in the RTW market?

I have very 'average' measurements and the main reason I've resorted to personalisation is the fact that RtW suits rarely come in a fabric I much like and, much worse, right now are available either in comically baggy format OR those stupid low-rise trousers.

I'm not as lucky as you with my body shape. At size 35 chest, my chances of finding something ready to wear have always been very low. In additions to this, my right shoulder is higher than the left and RTW coats would often display a 'break' there. Similar with shirts - even on a slim fit, the cuff is always too big for my wrist. Neckies? always at least 13 inches too long. If I were to think at the money I threw out in ill-fitting garments along the years, I could only describe bespoke as my rescuer I stopped buying and started thinking.

Best wishes for your future commissions!

[Luca]

Yes, thanks. There seems to be a decent amount of club-collared shirts in decent quality from RtW over the past 1-2 years. I had one made up MtM but frankly the RtW are comparable in fit/quality.

I did not return to the makers of that suit. I felt that having accepted it at the time and worn it a couple of times, I had left it a bit late. I'm sure that's wrong but... I guess I'll still get some wear out of it.

I've got another (more along the lines of bespoke) commission going that should be delivered soon. We'll see how THAT goes.

[hectorm]

A couple of pics of the aforementioned MtM commission which, despite the very nice PoW fabric, has felt definitely constricted in fit around the thighs and back.

Dear Luca,
Despite all odds I think you have managed to wear that suit very well. I like the way you have put it together with a lapelled vest, pocket square and contrast club collar.
It´s unfortunate that you don´t feel as comfortable in it as you seem to be.
The trousers do look tight indeed. That overall shape is not right, and least for a pair of weighty dress flannels. It makes for an umbalanced suit. It seems like the problem might have originated in the shop using one of those modern slim patterns and just cutting it to your leg length. Unless you specified those tapering legs and very narrow bottoms (in which case it might have been your fault), they should have recut the trousers. It seems that they didn´t care for retaining you as a customer and they got what they wanted.
I have had great experiences with MTM fit and quality when done with old fashioned tailors in small shops. In some cases when extensive hand work was employed you wouldn´t be able to tell the difference from a bespoke suit. My experiences have not been that good when the MTM was done in bigger houses. They tend to sell you their signature cut suit with adjusted arm and leg length measurements.

[Luca]

Despite all odds I think you have managed to wear that suit very well. I like the way you have put it together with a lapelled vest, pocket square and contrast club collar.
The trousers do look tight indeed. That overall shape is not right, and least for a pair of weighty dress flannels. It makes for an umbalanced suit. It seems like the problem might have originated in the shop using one of those modern slim patterns and just cutting it to your leg length. Unless you specified those tapering legs and very narrow bottoms (in which case it might have been your fault.

Thanks. The suit, looks good, overall, based on reactions. I have long preferred a narrow ankle opening but with a more gradual taper from a relatively full thigh-lap area. Live and learn, eh?

I have had great experiences with MTM fit and quality when done with old fashioned tailors in small shops. ...not been that good when the MTM was done in bigger houses.

That is a very useful observation. Thanks again.

[yialabis]

Luca , the suit looks fine for a reason, which is you make it look good ...that's what is important .
Regards
Vassilis