Advice wanted: re-building a wardrobe

"The brute covers himself, the rich man and the fop adorn themselves, the elegant man dresses!"

-Honore de Balzac

belimad
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Mon Jan 08, 2018 4:09 pm

old henry wrote:Sounds MTM to me. 2 to 3 weeks for two first suits ? How many fittings are you getting. Especially with a first order. Make sure your not paying bench price if it's MTM. See how the first two suits fit so necessary adjustments can be made. A speedy turn around does not go hand in hand with true bench, gents. But once your tailor nails down your pattern things do get done sooner. He has balanced your pattern and he has gotten to know your shoulders and arm pitch.
3 fittings. First one this week. The speedy turn around he is doing as a favour, as I come recommended by a friend of his. As I mentioned in my original post, I am in a bit of a hurry to at least have a couple of suits ready as quickly as possible. Then I will have more time to perfect and expand!

Thanks all again.
belimad
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Mon Jan 08, 2018 4:10 pm

bond_and_beyond wrote:
old henry wrote:Spot on bond. And also for the gent above. Why would you seek out another tailor before you have even tried on from this tailor ? Or did I miss something ?
Totally agree. I would start with one suit, see how it turns out before deciding any next moves. Maybe he doesn't like the fairly structured suit Russell makes (though he does both a softer version these days that I like, in addition to the traditional "City armour" banker suit) and wants something Italian instead. Hard to know until you see yourself in the suit.

BB
Fair question. As I mentioned, I'll need to re-build a wardrobe in a fairly short timeframe, thus my question on whether to start a "parallel process" with another tailor.
snapper
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Mon Jan 08, 2018 5:59 pm

I tend to use Grahame Browne for all my tailoring now and am quite happy with them. But it does take a bit of time and collaberation to get to a final stage of perfection. So as advised here, work with them but I would be surprised if you are not happy with the initial results.

Regards,
Snapper
soren
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Mon Jan 08, 2018 7:35 pm

Regarding Browne I have to say I have my reservations after seing some downright awful products from them, for instance this suit (unfortunately the post is in Danish but the photos speak for themselves): https://denvelklaedtemand.dk/?s=Graham+browne

However, I have also seen photos of nice products from Browne (Simon Crompton’s come to mind) so this is not to say that they can’t male you a good garment, but I’d be very alert during the frist fittings.

Cheers,
Søren
bond_and_beyond
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Mon Jan 08, 2018 8:28 pm

soren wrote:Regarding Browne I have to say I have my reservations after seing some downright awful products from them, for instance this suit (unfortunately the post is in Danish but the photos speak for themselves): https://denvelklaedtemand.dk/?s=Graham+browne

However, I have also seen photos of nice products from Browne (Simon Crompton’s come to mind) so this is not to say that they can’t male you a good garment, but I’d be very alert during the frist fittings.

Cheers,
Søren
That suit and GB was discussed ad nauseum on this rather amusing thread almost six years ago viewtopic.php?f=4&t=10916

I wouldn’t say it is representative for their work and I’ve discussed it with Russel in the past and he has his own side of the story.

But I agree that it is vital to pay good attention and don’t let yourself get rushed. I’ve found myself to be able to get very satisfactory results with a little effort.

BB
old henry
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Mon Jan 08, 2018 8:39 pm

As bond says. Give it time
belimad
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Tue Jan 09, 2018 10:57 am

Thanks all for the very valuable suggestions. I'll have my first fitting today, I'll take some pictures and post later. Would love to get your comments.
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culverwood
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Tue Jan 09, 2018 12:20 pm

As much fun as it might be to take pictures for comment remember the first fitting is the point at which your tailor will first see how the cloth he has cut sits on you. It will be a 1000-1 shot that there are no changes to be made and the tailor rather than us is in the best position to see what those changes should be. Don't tell him how do do his job based on the comments of a few internet people you will probably never meet who have only seen your stilted photos.

Let him do his job and if his style does not suit you choose another tailor. Some items like the length of the coat and the sleeve etc you will probably have already discussed and you may have opinions on and there is no right answer only personal taste on such aspects.
old henry
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Tue Jan 09, 2018 2:05 pm

If you find a tailor who , on your first meeting is only concerned with your measurements and shoulder height and posture and the bends and foibles of your structure ( making your extremely individual pattern).... and not selecting cloth and how many suits you should have - stick with him.
Last edited by old henry on Tue Jan 09, 2018 2:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Frans
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Tue Jan 09, 2018 2:10 pm

bond_and_beyond wrote: That suit and GB was discussed ad nauseum on this rather amusing thread almost six years ago

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=10916

I wouldn’t say it is representative for their work and I’ve discussed it with Russel in the past and he has his own side of the story.

BB
Forgive me, but I've had issues with almost all garments by the Graham Browne tailoring company. One pair of trousers was cut much too wide. "Wear it for some time", was cutter Russell's comment and sent me home. Only at my next visit he accepted to redo it.

A next pair of trousers was cut too narrow. Same procedure. Unfortunately there was not enough inlay for a perfect fit.
Another two pairs of trousers were executed okay though, I wear them regularly. After those mistakes I thought Russell had every detail of my pattern in place.

Nope. A next pair of trousers proved too narrow again. It was a checked cloth. The red overcheck in the pattern is supposed to go vertically down, but it doesn't, it's askew. The thing is: only a trained eye will notice. "It 's been cut wrong", another tailor told me. Why? Probably in order to save cloth.

One jacket by Graham Browne is okay, but the pockets are done sloppy. One sleeve proved to be half an inch shorter than the other. I had to show and tell Russell, otherwise he would have let me go home with that piece :lol:

Just for your info, I tried GB at the same time with two other London tailors, one off SR and one on SR. Neither as far as the process (i.e. the fittings, the customer service, the after service), nor as far as the fit and finishing of the garment is concerned can GB be compared with the other tailors. Little or no effort is put in shaping, in shrinking cloth at essential places, nor in finishing. The jackets are rather stiff and the cloth has the hand of - forgive me - a potato sack, that's what the feeling reminds me of.

To be fair, at Graham Browne's price point of little more than £ 1000,- one cannot expect perfect fit, perfect execution, nor big consistency in the heart of London. Price and speed are their most important parameters, therefore an almost industrial (machine-made) approach. A big production must be more important in that model than precision.

There is certainly a market for machine made, rapid bespoke like Graham Browne. People that are in a hurry or need a suit for the wedding of a cousin. I do respect that not everyone has the time, the means nor the interest to pay the full price for an old fashioned, artisanal product made with sweat and which takes many weeks, months to produce. Fair enough. At some point in my life I didn't have that either. If only GB were open and honest about their product! In my experience Dan and Russell are not. They present their totally different product as if it can stand the proof with other bespoke. Newcomers and untrained eyes are made believe that they make a very, very good deal. That's a very sweet melody.

I respect of course if other members have had other experiences with GB.
I can also see that some of the GB jackets/suits look fairly good on pictures.
This is just my story, just my 2 cents. :D
Perhaps I have just been unlucky :lol:

(PS Soren, I may be wrong but I think I have seen that blog post about the brown suit in an English version as well?)

On a side note, S. Crompton is not an objective voice in this matter. His blog only became as big as it is today thanks to his review of Graham Browne. Until that moment he didn't have the means for bespoke. After the review Crompton went on to other tailors and presented his publicity and set up of blogs (e.g. Anderson Sheppard's Notebook, Timothy Everest's blog on their former site) in exchange for a suit. It was win-win for Crompton and the tailoring houses. I do enjoy Crompton's blog, though, as I have written elsewhere, it's a source of news and inspiration, but I do not regard him as a truth finding journalist (if truth exists :wink: )

Belimad, I wish you all good luck with your two suits!
As you were presented by good friends of his, Russell will certainly do an extra effort to make things turn out properly :D
aston
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Tue Jan 09, 2018 2:53 pm

I've had many suits from Russell and in the main they have been perfectly fine, and in that sense good value for money. On the odd occasion things have gone wrong they have been put right willingly.

By contrast my first commission with a highly regarded Row house was a shocker and after several attempts to put it right, the agreed outcome was a refund.

Good luck with GB.
belimad
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Tue Jan 09, 2018 3:31 pm

I am happy to report that I felt the first fitting went really well. We discussed shoulder, he took some input on armpit tightness and overall fit, and had some suggestions on length and button placement which I thought where pretty spot on and useful.

I am back for a second fitting (and trousers) next week. Will report back.
alden
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Tue Jan 09, 2018 4:24 pm

HI Frans,

That is a very worrisome report indeed. At least its the kind of thing I was worried about. And coming from you it has weight because you know your subject well.

What I do not like to hear is that a clearly MTM product is being pitched and sold as something else.

Cheers
aston
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Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:22 pm

Michael

GB is definitely not MTM being pitched as something else. Long seams are machined (not that that is unusual these days), the rest is pretty much what you would normally categorise as bespoke.
soren
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Tue Jan 09, 2018 6:02 pm

Frans, indeed, the English version of the article can be found here https://sartorialnotes.com/2013/04/14/g ... t-you-get/

I just chose the Danish version because it had more photos to document what I believe is a sloppily made garment. And you’re definitely right about Crompton, not an unbiased source at all, it was merely to stress that they apparently are capable of producing well-fitting garment.

Aston, we might disagree, but I would not categorise something as bespoke when the canvas is machine padded (not to mention the above described experience by Frans). This is not to argue that GB is a waste of money, and in that sense I think the title of the article by Sartorial Notes is spot on. However, 1000 pounds is still quite an amount of money, and why not go to Italy instead and have a suit made for 1000... euros :shock: 8)

Btw I have no personal experience with GB (nor will I ever have), so it’s definitely not because I have anything against them personally. I have just been quite mortified that a jacket looking like that on the link above can actually leave the cutters room from a shop claiming to do bespoke.
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