Dinner suit in midnight blue

[Concordia]

Barathea will generally look blacker than most other worsted options. A&S has gone one step further, commissioning 10oz and 12oz stuff from Smiths (I think) that is even a little blacker than the normal black. I don't know if it is just dyed better or if it has a hint of blue in it, but it does look elegant.

One of these days, though, I may try an 11oz black flannel rig to wear with black suede shoes. Not sure why I would ever need such a thing, but it does sound like a nice thing to relax in.

[Boisey]

I have gotten to the stage in my bespoke career that I feel ready to commission a DJ. It will be a three piece, peak lapel in a thirties style with horse shoe waist coat.

I am almost certain that I will go with midnight blue (as dark as at all possible), and have been looking at the Smith formal book, particularly the 10oz barathea (no 8829 I believe).

Do any of the members have experience with this book, or have any other recommendations for very dark midnight blue with little/no shine?

I understand that 13oz would be too warm, but I am willing to consider it

Many thanks,
BB

Personally I really like the Smith's SW 8810:
10 oz (310gms) Midnight Blue Barathea
71% Merino Wool
29% Super Kid Mohair

I believe 10/11oz is the ideal weight for a Dinner Jacket as the last thing you want is to be getting hot in these events which tend to be indoors. The Mohair has more body to it and gives the cloth a nice crispness. Although it does have a slight shine to it.

I have made this up quite a lot recently for our customers that are looking for a Midnight Blue and we always recommend trimming them with black, for two reasons.

Firstly It is neigh on impossible to match a Midnight Blue to the trimmings these days, you usually get a poor contrast that just doesn't look appealing. Secondly, if you are are going down the Midnight Blue route, chances are you want to stand out a little from the majority and using the black trimming will show off the shade of the fabric to its fullest with the correct contrast.

The Smith's SW8829:
Midnight Barathea 10/11oz (325gms)
100% Ultrafine Merino

This is also a great cloth but the texture is much different from the SW8810, slightly heavier as well as being darker (Blacker than black). My preference is the 8810 but you can't go wrong with the 8829 in terms of how it makes up either and perhaps it suit's what you are looking for with the little shine/darker elements. Just thought I would let you know about the mohair option.

Cheers,

Matt DeBoise

Steed Bespoke Tailors

matthew@steed.co.uk

http://www.steed.co.uk

[bond_and_beyond]

Many thanks Matt. Very interesting to hear your viewpoint as a tailor. Much appreciated.

Many thanks also to the other Loungers for your thoughts and experiences.

Went to the tailor's this afternoon and ended up choosing the 8829. As Matt pointed out it is slightly darker than the 8810 and has little shine. I was tempted by the 8810 too, but the 8829 "spoke to me" more for some reason.

My order was:

• One button peak lapel coat (lapels with lots of belly in a 30s style, I showed a photo of the "Fred Astaire" dinner jacket Steed (funny coincidence ) made for Voxsartoria as a point of reference, though I might not go for the small "gap" in the lapel, though I understand that is quite retro). I ended up, after some discussion with my tailor, going with double vents. I realize it is bit less formal, but it both seems more practical and I also find the slight "squareness" of the double vents preferable from an esthetic viewpoint to the more "tubular" look of a ventless coat.
  
  Three button "tulip" shaped waist coat (for the basted fitting the tailor will cut the waistcoat straight and we'll "work our way out" from there).
  
  My standard double forward pleated trouser, but with fish-tailed back, a first for me.

My tailor said he did not like a button hole in the lapel of a dinner jacket as it for him ruined the cleanness of the silk facing. What do you think? Is a lapel button hole a must?

BB

[Melcombe]

My tailor said he did not like a button hole in the lapel of a dinner jacket as it for him ruined the cleanness of the silk facing. What do you think? Is a lapel button hole a must?

BB

Im with your tailor on that one. I'd say no to a BH - how often would you actually use it for a flower? If you're wearing mainly in the evening, you probably never will.

[davidhuh]

My tailor said he did not like a button hole in the lapel of a dinner jacket as it for him ruined the cleanness of the silk facing. What do you think? Is a lapel button hole a must?

BB

Dear BB,

listen to your tailor - and please, reflect again on your double vents. If your are worried about freedom of movement, make sure that the coat is not too tight to the body.

Cheers, David

[bond_and_beyond]

Many thanks, I will forgo the BH

As regards vents I am still leaning towards double vents, though I may be swayed (there is still time for me to change my mind)...

Perhaps we should do a short poll:

Who goes for vents on their SB dinner jackets? Yes or no

(Famous examples that come to mind are James Bond in Dr No, and the DoW).

BB

[Boisey]

I am actually with you on the side vents, even for the dinner suit. Yes it isn't traditional but I also prefer the look and comfort of the side vents.

Dad (Edwin) says he has a buttonhole on his dinner jacket but we both understand your tailors good point of keeping the facings clean.

P.S Funny coincidence with the photo of the one we made for Bill

Matt

[bond_and_beyond]

I am actually with you on the side vents, even for the dinner suit. Yes it isn't traditional but I also prefer the look and comfort of the side vents.

Dad (Edwin) says he has a buttonhole on his dinner jacket but we both understand your tailors good point of keeping the facings clean.

P.S Funny coincidence with the photo of the one we made for Bill

Matt

Many thanks Matt.

It was a funny coincidence indeed It is a beautiful garment.

On the subject of the Astaire DJ I was wondering if you needed to make any adjustments to the breast pocket due to the wide lapels so that the pocket square is not covered by the lapel or creates a bulge in the lapel?


BB

[Boisey]

I am actually with you on the side vents, even for the dinner suit. Yes it isn't traditional but I also prefer the look and comfort of the side vents.

Dad (Edwin) says he has a buttonhole on his dinner jacket but we both understand your tailors good point of keeping the facings clean.

P.S Funny coincidence with the photo of the one we made for Bill

Matt

Many thanks Matt.

It was a funny coincidence indeed It is a beautiful garment.

On the subject of the Astaire DJ I was wondering if you needed to make any adjustments to the breast pocket due to the wide lapels so that the pocket square is not covered by the lapel or creates a bulge in the lapel?


BB

Thank you for the kind words.

In terms of the out breast welt posistion, to be honest, Dad can't remember as when we are marking it all out we do those details all by "rock of eye" so with the lapels being wider he could well of done that without specifically recalling.

Matt

[bond_and_beyond]

Many thanks Matt. Is my understanding correct that the width of the breast pocket and its distance from the arm hole (horizontally) is more or less given / standard so that there isn't much leeway for the tailor to 'move it around' to cater for a wider lapel?

BB

[alden]

Matt

Beautiful job on the 30s style Dinner Suit. Looks great.

http://www.steed.co.uk/en/blog/from-sta ... nner-suit/

Cheers

[hectorm]

My tailor said he did not like a button hole in the lapel of a dinner jacket as it for him ruined the cleanness of the silk facing......
As regards vents I am still leaning towards double vents, though I may be swayed (there is still time for me to change my mind)...

Somehow something is telling me that the absence of a buttonhole on the left lapel (for the sake of cleanness) is not compatible with the presence of side vents on a dinner jacket.
My advice is getting the button hole. Sooner or later during the next 20 years you´ll use it and your boutonniere will not have to be awkwardly pinned.
Regarding the side vents, I agree with David. Leave them for your lounging suits. A one button SB DJ with peak lapels will have better lines and still plenty of room with no vents.
But this is just my opinion.
The important thing is that you have done your homework, consulted the best and came down to your own conclusion.
Enjoy the ride!

[ay329]

If you will not put a flower through the lapel hole, then do not get it

But if you choose the awesome stuff through Gentlemans Gazzette, then make sure the lapel hole works

[bond_and_beyond]

Somehow something is telling me that the absence of a buttonhole on the left lapel (for the sake of cleanness) is not compatible with the presence of side vents on a dinner jacket.
My advice is getting the button hole. Sooner or later during the next 20 years you´ll use it and your boutonniere will not have to be awkwardly pinned.
Regarding the side vents, I agree with David. Leave them for your lounging suits. A one button SB DJ with peak lapels will have better lines and still plenty of room with no vents.
But this is just my opinion.
The important thing is that you have done your homework, consulted the best and came down to your own conclusion.
Enjoy the ride!

The lapel BH and its relation to vents on a dinner jacket, now that is a connection that has never occurred to me before

The minutae we bespoke fans can get into

Yet, I see, somehow, your point.

I am still not 100% sure about the side vents. As I have never had a ventless jacket made before I am unsure how it would look on me. All my suits have double vents, therefore I know what look to expect in that regard. For me going ventless would be an experiment, and I am not sure that one should experiment too much with a DJ, as one usually will only have one made..

Can't rule out that my tailor will get a call in the next few days regarding the vents

BB

[davidhuh]

Yet, I see, somehow, your point.

I am still not 100% sure about the side vents. As I have never had a ventless jacket made before I am unsure how it would look on me. All my suits have double vents, therefore I know what look to expect in that regard. For me going ventless would be an experiment, and I am not sure that one should experiment too much with a DJ, as one usually will only have one made..

BB

Dear BB,

the "experiment" in my eyes are the side vents. I'm afraid you are comparing apples with pears. All my suits have side vents, but of course. And my dinner jacket hasn't...

You will be wearing your DJ a couple of times a year for a couple of hours. My advice was to make sure the coat is not cut too tight to your body. This will give you the required room and freedom for move.

Cheers, David