The London Lounge

I was talking to a tailor today to order to some grey flannel trousers to wear with tweed sportscoats or blue blazers. He maintains that by its very nature flannel rarely goes above 13 oz in weight. Does that sound plausible to you?

Yes it does. Any heavier would be too warm. 13oz is fine for cold weather.

BoB

14oz is pretty commonly available for flannel - especially solids.

I disagree with the previous post regarding the weight of trousers. I would get the heaviest weight you can find for trousers as, especially with flannel, it looks and wears better. I would not say the same thing about a suit or sportcoat as, if you tend to run warm, you might find you overheat with heavier weights wrapped around your chest. But this is rarely a problem with trousers, at least for me.

dopey.

I don't intend to take Sator's lines away from him but I wore 17 ounce flannels yesterday in 60 degree (F) weather and was comfortable. The heavier weight adds to the drape.

I have two piece lounge suit made of 14/15 Oz flannel. It doesn't run that warm in winter at all. If I could get hold of any, I would gladly have 16-20 Oz flannels made up.

Sator

How dry is it where you live, and how much heat do you generate when walking? If you get bone-dry winters with screaming winds, 16oz woolens can be surprisingly comfortable until you come indoors.

If you're not sure, start with 11/12 oz woolens or 12/13oz worsteds. You'll figure out what you like soon enough.

I think a heavier cloth (15-16 oz) would be comfortable and also preferable for drape purposes (especially as in my experience flannel trousers do not hold their crease very well), except that it seems harder to find. Do you know which books have it?

I think Harrison's have some 16 oz. flannel.

J&J Minnis offer a few 15/16 Oz weight ones:

http://www.hfw-huddersfield.co.uk/hardy ... o=M?cate=F?

They are very nice. Fox, alas, stops at 13 Oz unless it is a bespoke order.

I find that the heavier flannels are more tightly woven, thus partly mitigating the tendency for flannels to run warmer than their weight.

The equation that goes 7 Oz = cool 10 = moderately cool is plotted out in the mind as a linear formula and people assume that ergo 14Oz= very warm and 18 Oz= thermo-nuclear meltdown. It just doesn't work that way.

Sator

Interesting points, Sator. But if heavier flannel is woven in a tighter way, doesn't that partly reduce the 'fluffy'/tetured appeal that sets flannel apart from worsteds and other types of fabric?

Forgot to say: thanks for the pointer, Sator!

This is definitely what is was looking for, and I can't wait to show it to the tailor (not my usual one -- geographical constraints, alas):

http://www.hfw-huddersfield.co.uk/hardy ... =133322048?

It's not the cheapest flannel I've seen, but it's nonetheless reasonably priced, for what promises to be excellent cloth (I generally like Minnis, though for some reason I never had anything made from their cloth). I hope the tailor will be able to order it, otherwise I'll source it directly from Minnis.

Cheers,

RD

Anonymous wrote:Interesting points, Sator. But if heavier flannel is woven in a tighter way, doesn't that partly reduce the 'fluffy'/tetured appeal that sets flannel apart from worsteds and other types of fabric?

The finishing is the same, so outwardly it looks unchanged.

What I means is this: wools are either carded (woollen) or worsted. Carded cloths are looser and a bit fluffy. If you have a little of the fluff it stays fluffy, but if you pack enough of it together it will start to become compacted in the middle. The outside may stay fluffy, but the middle bit gets squashed together. That's what I mean about heavier flannels being denser/tighter.

Sator

I see - it is heavier and sturdier, but it still has the fluffy appearance and feel I like so much. Thanks a lot for a very clear explanation.

RadicalDog

(Always forget that signatures don't appear in this forum - sorry)

A final perplexity. I was looking at Harrison, and I found this:

http://www.lbd-harrisons.com/harrisons_flannels.html

"FLANNELS -350 – 495gms. West of England Woollen and Worsted Flannels.
Famous the world over."

Now what is a worsted flannel? I've seen worsted tweeds (i.e. worsteds made to resemble tweeds -- not my cup of tea), but I'd never heard of worsted flannels. Do they look like flannel but have the advantages of worsted (crease-resistance and durability)? Or are they sad compromises like worsted-tweeds?

As I say cloths are either carded/woollen weaves or worsted.

A worsted flannel is an oxymoron of sorts, in my view. It is a worsted that is finished to look like a flannel. I expect a flannel to be a carded cloth. If you look carefully at it, you can see behind the flannelised finish, it looks more like a worsted. It generally behaves more like a worsted in its longevity and tensile strength, which some may regard as being desirable.

It's not generally my cup of tea, however.

Sator