Dear readers,
This post is mostly aimed towards old Henry and Michael but also anyone who has vast experience with bespoke.
How should the balance on a jacket sit front
- back and left-right? Should the front be parallel to the ground and equal in length to the back or should it be angled and shorter in the front than the back (I have seen and have both)? Should the jacket be perfectly balanced L-R or some deviations are desired or considered acceptable?
What length would be considered appropriate? Or how would you know if a jacket is too long? I prefer longer jackets but tailors seem to be resistant to cutting them longer than what they would “calculate.” Half the length of the collar to the ground seems to not be quite as long as I like it and would prefer 6/8 inch to an inch longer. However, I see myself only through my eyes and cannot see myself “from the side” allowing me to judge length differently. I am aware of the rule of covering my seat but how far past just covering my seat could I go?
(I am 190cm (6 3’) and 81kg with long slim legs which is why I believe I can afford myself a longer jacket)
I would be very grateful to insights I could get.
Kindly,
Alex
Balance on a jacket and jacket length
A coat should balance. It should plumb bob evenly front back, right left. If a coat kicks out in the back or rises in the front it is not in balance. Lack of balance from a true bespoke tailor is not acceptable.How should the balance on a jacket sit front
- back and left-right? Should the front be parallel to the ground and equal in length to the back or should it be angled and shorter in the front than the back (I have seen and have both)? Should the jacket be perfectly balanced L-R or some deviations are desired or considered acceptable?
There are many detailed LL posts on "coat length" you might want to read that go into great detail. Coat length is a function of the relation between the length of your torso and the length of your legs. The calculation of half the distance from collar to the ground should just get a tailor in the general area of the correct length. From there, a good tailor will use an expert's eye to judge the most aesthetic and "balanced" measure. A client with short legs and a long torso will take a shorter coat because a long coat will make the legs appear shorter and as a consequence further out of balance. A client (like yourself) with long legs compared to the torso may very well take a longer coat because a short coat will make the legs look longer and out of balance. Very few of us have legs and torso in perfect balance, so the half the distance measure is not set in stone as it does not work for most of us. I am 6'3" like you but my short legs and long torso lead me to wear a shorter coat than what you might wear, for example.What length would be considered appropriate? Or how would you know if a jacket is too long? I prefer longer jackets but tailors seem to be resistant to cutting them longer than what they would “calculate.” Half the length of the collar to the ground seems to not be quite as long as I like it and would prefer 6/8 inch to an inch longer. However, I see myself only through my eyes and cannot see myself “from the side” allowing me to judge length differently. I am aware of the rule of covering my seat but how far past just covering my seat could I go?
(I am 190cm (6 3’) and 81kg with long slim legs which is why I believe I can afford myself a longer jacket)
But more importantly the correct measure for anything is the measure that makes you feel like "you hold the world in the palm of your hands!" Only you can decide what that measure will be. Only you will see it. Only you will recognize it. Only you. The best tailor in the world, can get you into the ballpark, but you have to choose your seat.
Cheers
Dear Michael,
Thank you very much for your insight. I have not yet found the tailor who makes me look like that. People around me always seem very “impressed” by how I wear suits, but I personally am never fully satisfied with some aspect, could be half centimeter in proportion somewhere.
I am still searching for a tailor who will be able to understand me what I like, how I want to look and be received. I have had issues with that so far because people assume that because of my relative young age I want to look modern when in fact Humphrey bogart, Nigel Hawthorne (Sir Humphrey Appleby), Paul eddington ( Jim Hacker) and Ian Richardson (Francis Urqhuart) are much more style icons of mine rather than Instagram famous bloggers ( in addition to typical icons such as Fred Astaire, Gary cooper, Edward VIII, etc).
Thanks for your assistance and anyone’s view is welcome.
Best,
Alex
Thank you very much for your insight. I have not yet found the tailor who makes me look like that. People around me always seem very “impressed” by how I wear suits, but I personally am never fully satisfied with some aspect, could be half centimeter in proportion somewhere.
I am still searching for a tailor who will be able to understand me what I like, how I want to look and be received. I have had issues with that so far because people assume that because of my relative young age I want to look modern when in fact Humphrey bogart, Nigel Hawthorne (Sir Humphrey Appleby), Paul eddington ( Jim Hacker) and Ian Richardson (Francis Urqhuart) are much more style icons of mine rather than Instagram famous bloggers ( in addition to typical icons such as Fred Astaire, Gary cooper, Edward VIII, etc).
Thanks for your assistance and anyone’s view is welcome.
Best,
Alex
All I would add to Michael's reply is that, for me, it is vital that the fronts of the jacket are parallel to each other. I have had several coats made when one side or the other (usually the right side) falls away such that the fronts are not parallel. The problem lies at the shoulder. Sometimes, the tailor will decline to see what I am pointing out, but I see it and that is all that matters. I have had this problem with some very well-regarded tailors and unless the problem is corrected, the commissions cease.
And the same is true for jacket length. Remember, it is your jacket. If you want it knee-length, then your tailor should either make it knee length or refuse the commission. More sensibly, if you want your jacket a little longer, then that is how your tailor should make it. If he or she does not, find another tailor. Putting on a bespoke suit or jacket should make you feel like the master of the universe. It doesn't always happen, but when it does—that's the feeling!
And the same is true for jacket length. Remember, it is your jacket. If you want it knee-length, then your tailor should either make it knee length or refuse the commission. More sensibly, if you want your jacket a little longer, then that is how your tailor should make it. If he or she does not, find another tailor. Putting on a bespoke suit or jacket should make you feel like the master of the universe. It doesn't always happen, but when it does—that's the feeling!
-
Screaminmarlon
- Posts: 920
- Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2011 7:56 am
- Location: Milan, Italy
- Contact:
if you’re lucky enough to find a good taylor, the best thing is to trust his craft, having made your choices.
A taylor will be far more attentive about his work than a customer could ever be, but to each his own
A taylor will be far more attentive about his work than a customer could ever be, but to each his own
Dear Alex,
you already got very sound advice from Michael, Andy and Screamin'. What I would add is
you already got very sound advice from Michael, Andy and Screamin'. What I would add is
- I had a few balance issues in the past. My shoulders are not easy to fit, and if a tailor is rushing or I use him for the first time, things can get messy easily. Generally, you should be able to spot this in the second fitting. Even later, you can still correct a mistake in most cases. Sticking to a tailor also helps!
- Coat length should not be too difficult given your size. It can be a bit tricky with smaller men. My coat lengths vary considerably, up to 10cm for both DB and SB coats. in general, suits and coats done by my English tailor tend to be more classic and on the longer side. The Italian tailor tends to cut a little shorter, and the unknown mystery tailor does what I tell him to do. When a coat is more on the sportive side, I keep them shorter. With some DBs, I went Kent style which is shorter than normal. So the coat length also depends on the garment's cut, on whether the coat is part of suit or not and also your taste.
- Finally, my last suggestion is that you should start experimenting with plain, unicolour cloth. And perhaps most important, don't be obsessed with "perfection". You want to wear a hand-made garment. Poster boys go to Ralph Lauren & Co.
Alex,
You've had excellent advice as usual on jacket length from the membership. I'd mention just a couple of other points you might consider when employing the criteria already mentioned.
First, if one (as I do) has long legs for his height, he may ipso facto have a proportionally short waist. This means his button point will likely be a little higher on the body than the average. This fact adds a variable in harmonizing the overall silhouette. (I would not advise lowering the button point below the natural waist.)
If such a short-waisted man has broad shoulders and a trim waist and hips, a longer skirt on the jacket as you propose may still support a pleasingly masculine silhouette given long legs: the so-called "male V" is still preserved. (And thus as David says, a 'classic' SR silhouette - what one Row tailor referred to as "a good length of coat.") If such a man has average or narrow shoulders, and/or little or no reduction through the waist and/or hips, a longer coat may result in a more boyish, tubular silhouette, with less presence. (This effect can be somewhat ameliorated by extended shoulders in the jacket, but that must be carefully done or the jacket, by being both longer and wider than usual, can appear simply too big.) For this body type, the average-length or shorter jacket skirt may yield a flattering compromise by not emphasizing the lack of taper from the shoulders, while making no attempt to minimize leg length. There's a reason that fashion drawings have always elongated the legs - long legs are usually associated with elegance, so they are not an inherent drawback. A decent tailor will be balancing all these elements to your particulars as he makes his recommendations, and as others have said, you'll want to be an informed interlocutor.
Second is the obvious fact that our perceptions of what makes a "normal" jacket length are at least somewhat affected, even in conservative circles, by the trends of the times. Late 1920s and early 1930s jackets were, on the evidence of documentary-film crowds and feature films both, shorter on average than those from the end of the 1930s through the early to mid 1950s. We've been of late in a very-short-jacket fashion phase, and while few here would countenance the Thom Browne bum-freezers, I've observed that many bespoke tailors (including mine) are cutting modestly shorter jackets than they did when I started visiting the Row 15 years ago. I mention this only as a reminder that rules of thumb, while essential, are not themselves immutable. So don't worry if, in achieving the most harmonious balance of factors, the result departs from some abstract average. As Michael says, what counts is what allows you to present your essential self most effectively.
You've had excellent advice as usual on jacket length from the membership. I'd mention just a couple of other points you might consider when employing the criteria already mentioned.
First, if one (as I do) has long legs for his height, he may ipso facto have a proportionally short waist. This means his button point will likely be a little higher on the body than the average. This fact adds a variable in harmonizing the overall silhouette. (I would not advise lowering the button point below the natural waist.)
If such a short-waisted man has broad shoulders and a trim waist and hips, a longer skirt on the jacket as you propose may still support a pleasingly masculine silhouette given long legs: the so-called "male V" is still preserved. (And thus as David says, a 'classic' SR silhouette - what one Row tailor referred to as "a good length of coat.") If such a man has average or narrow shoulders, and/or little or no reduction through the waist and/or hips, a longer coat may result in a more boyish, tubular silhouette, with less presence. (This effect can be somewhat ameliorated by extended shoulders in the jacket, but that must be carefully done or the jacket, by being both longer and wider than usual, can appear simply too big.) For this body type, the average-length or shorter jacket skirt may yield a flattering compromise by not emphasizing the lack of taper from the shoulders, while making no attempt to minimize leg length. There's a reason that fashion drawings have always elongated the legs - long legs are usually associated with elegance, so they are not an inherent drawback. A decent tailor will be balancing all these elements to your particulars as he makes his recommendations, and as others have said, you'll want to be an informed interlocutor.
Second is the obvious fact that our perceptions of what makes a "normal" jacket length are at least somewhat affected, even in conservative circles, by the trends of the times. Late 1920s and early 1930s jackets were, on the evidence of documentary-film crowds and feature films both, shorter on average than those from the end of the 1930s through the early to mid 1950s. We've been of late in a very-short-jacket fashion phase, and while few here would countenance the Thom Browne bum-freezers, I've observed that many bespoke tailors (including mine) are cutting modestly shorter jackets than they did when I started visiting the Row 15 years ago. I mention this only as a reminder that rules of thumb, while essential, are not themselves immutable. So don't worry if, in achieving the most harmonious balance of factors, the result departs from some abstract average. As Michael says, what counts is what allows you to present your essential self most effectively.
-
- Information
-
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 13 guests