Well now we can rage against Knize! Outrageous prices.
And Italy is just across the border.
I don't understand.....
Anybody here a customer of theirs?
Anderson & Sheppard Prices
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Guest
It seems to me that the misinformed (purposely or otherwise) members of this thread wish to see the end of A&S. Spurious comments about the number of their Cutters or about the strategy of their owners strangely go unchallenged.
Either there is an interest in spreading malicious gossip, or (as I find it hard to believe of the 'informed' members of this forum) it is purely ignorant.
If these questions about A&S are really of interest to you, why don't you ask the people who know the real answers? If not, I expect to be able to enjoy many similar and negative individual comments or threads about other authentic SR businesses.
Either there is an interest in spreading malicious gossip, or (as I find it hard to believe of the 'informed' members of this forum) it is purely ignorant.
If these questions about A&S are really of interest to you, why don't you ask the people who know the real answers? If not, I expect to be able to enjoy many similar and negative individual comments or threads about other authentic SR businesses.
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Guest
I agree. But who has the real answers?It seems to me that the misinformed (purposely or otherwise) members of this thread wish to see the end of A&S. Spurious comments about the number of their Cutters or about the strategy of their owners strangely go unchallenged.
Either there is an interest in spreading malicious gossip, or (as I find it hard to believe of the 'informed' members of this forum) it is purely ignorant.
If these questions about A&S are really of interest to you, why don't you ask the people who know the real answers? If not, I expect to be able to enjoy many similar and negative individual comments or threads about other authentic SR businesses
I think that it has been confirmed that A&S does infact have only one coat cutter - Mr. John Hitchcock - who is indeed very well regarded.
Is that information incorrect?
As to the intentions of A&S owners, it is quite impossible to confirm or deny such matters. Time will tell as these matters slowly evolve.
I think that no one in London Lounge has written anything which is spurious or deliberately incorrect .
If there is misinformation, then please do identify it and set the record straight.
I assume that all who write here have no ill intention or hidden agenda and certainly no here wants to deliberately spread misinformation. I haven't picked up that this is the case at all.
Obviously, the venerable tailor has many satisfied customers and is daily acquiring new customers. There are perhaps an equal number of customers who are defecting. And some of those are returning. Probably all very common in the tailoring business.
The proof is in the pudding and the debate will continue regarding A&S.
Certainly A&S has gotten wonderful press following the Pitti Uomo exhibition and garnered many new orders as a result. I myself would love to be able to order some of their clothing.
But please tell us what is the malicious gossip and spurious information to which you refer in this thread.
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Guest
I deon't even understand why there would be a controversy related to A&S. Their prices? They seem well in line with other tailors on the Row. And why are tailors in London, Paris and New York so expensive? Is this a conspiracy? Obviously there are powerful economic forces that drive bespoke suit prices to their present level, some combination of rent, dwindling numbers of tailors in many of the developed nations, and demand. And they structure their costs so as to correspond to their prices, it is a vicious circle. So far as quality, even if I listen to every anecdote on the web, A&S appears to be a very good tailor and has been one for a very long time, which is impressive. No tailor is a magician. He is just a tailor.
If I walked in to the A&S parking lot and saw nothing but Rolls, I would know that I was getting screwed. But I doubt that is the case.
Grousing about A&S's prices is like the AK-shirt price issue, a non-issue so far as I am concerned. There are so many shirtmakers (just in NYC mind you) more expensive than the AK, he should be ashamed of himself. Anxiety about A&S prices is the result of over-educated middle class people trying to live above their means.
If I walked in to the A&S parking lot and saw nothing but Rolls, I would know that I was getting screwed. But I doubt that is the case.
Grousing about A&S's prices is like the AK-shirt price issue, a non-issue so far as I am concerned. There are so many shirtmakers (just in NYC mind you) more expensive than the AK, he should be ashamed of himself. Anxiety about A&S prices is the result of over-educated middle class people trying to live above their means.
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Guest
That's right, prices are just an economics thing. Really no use complaining or grousing.
THere are many less expensive tailors. And some more expensive tailors. So we might just as well pay up or shut up because a few message board geeks aren't going to change anything anyway. Middle class, indeed, all this needless grousing and discussion of price!
BTW, the parking lot at A&S is really pretty much filled up with Rollers. And Bentleys, too. But that's OK too because that's what most of middle class London is driving anyway, these days.
I for one love A&S and will pay up given the quality bespoke clothes they make. They are inimitable at any price. Naysayers be damned!
THere are many less expensive tailors. And some more expensive tailors. So we might just as well pay up or shut up because a few message board geeks aren't going to change anything anyway. Middle class, indeed, all this needless grousing and discussion of price!
BTW, the parking lot at A&S is really pretty much filled up with Rollers. And Bentleys, too. But that's OK too because that's what most of middle class London is driving anyway, these days.
I for one love A&S and will pay up given the quality bespoke clothes they make. They are inimitable at any price. Naysayers be damned!
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Guest
Much talk about the demise of A & S is not supported by the facts.
If A & S did not have an ongoing business, then it would have shut its doors when it had to abandon its premises on Savile Row. Many businesses simply close shop when they are forced to move; this is especially so for marginally profitable businesses.
If A & S were not interested in the future it would not have developed a website, joined the new Savile Row Association, and participated in the Pitti show in Florence.
Case closed.
If A & S did not have an ongoing business, then it would have shut its doors when it had to abandon its premises on Savile Row. Many businesses simply close shop when they are forced to move; this is especially so for marginally profitable businesses.
If A & S were not interested in the future it would not have developed a website, joined the new Savile Row Association, and participated in the Pitti show in Florence.
Case closed.
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Guest
I have just had a minute’s time to read this thread. The conversation is more about SR prices and the challenge of bespoke in general than one about AS. I plan on addressing many of the issues raised in this thread more completely on the main forum.
The writer above who feels AS is being picked on should understand that AS is to many the standard by which other Savile Row houses are judged. And that is a good thing if you own AS shares. But when you are number one, you come under a good deal of scrutiny. That is to be expected. Fair analysis should be the result of this scrutiny. AS (and John Hitchcock) is the only major house that has gained acceptance into the LL Certified Artisans Program. That is the result of my analysis of the firm. If the quality of their work were to decline, they would lose certification. There is no evidence that a decline in quality or danger of such exists at AS presently.
As regards AS owners and their plans, I know that they intend on protecting the tradition of the firm with vigor. They understand the extent to which a jewel is in the palm of their hand. I suspect they are simply trying to bring the firm’s 19th century business processes in line with those of the 21st. That means such things as improved computer systems, communications and a website. I think all AS customers will be grateful for the investments and improvements.
With regards to the number of cutters or tailors on the staff, I am quite sure that the MD, John Hitchcock, knows how many of each the firm requires to function properly.
Either you fit into the AS way of doing business or you don’t. It is just that simple. On the one hand, AS is definitely not for everybody. On the other hand, when I find a firm that is for everybody, I will make sure and avoid it like the plague!
Cheers
M Alden
The writer above who feels AS is being picked on should understand that AS is to many the standard by which other Savile Row houses are judged. And that is a good thing if you own AS shares. But when you are number one, you come under a good deal of scrutiny. That is to be expected. Fair analysis should be the result of this scrutiny. AS (and John Hitchcock) is the only major house that has gained acceptance into the LL Certified Artisans Program. That is the result of my analysis of the firm. If the quality of their work were to decline, they would lose certification. There is no evidence that a decline in quality or danger of such exists at AS presently.
As regards AS owners and their plans, I know that they intend on protecting the tradition of the firm with vigor. They understand the extent to which a jewel is in the palm of their hand. I suspect they are simply trying to bring the firm’s 19th century business processes in line with those of the 21st. That means such things as improved computer systems, communications and a website. I think all AS customers will be grateful for the investments and improvements.
With regards to the number of cutters or tailors on the staff, I am quite sure that the MD, John Hitchcock, knows how many of each the firm requires to function properly.
Either you fit into the AS way of doing business or you don’t. It is just that simple. On the one hand, AS is definitely not for everybody. On the other hand, when I find a firm that is for everybody, I will make sure and avoid it like the plague!
Cheers
M Alden
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Guest
It's good to read that A&S owners intend to protect and perpetuate the traditions of the firm and understand its place in the hearts of bespoke aficionados.
Its iconic silhouette and consistent adherence to it are the heart and soul of A&S.
John Hitchcock is a wonderful cutter with an uncanny eye and wonderful, traditional sense of style and proportion. His continued management of A&S is essential to preserving its traditions.
I look forward to learning more about the inside story of A&S and its future plans. Perhaps an interview with John Hitchcock , and even A&S owners, would be in order at some time. I think that there can be no better source than LL to get the facts straight on A&S, objectively and without sentimentality.
Infact, that would make a wonderful project to include some of the other traditional powerhouses of men's style such as Caraceni, Rubinacci and on.....
Has anyone here attending English Cut at Pitti? I would love to see some photos of what A&S presented as well as the other SR houses.
It is interesting to read of the Italians continued admiration for English Men's Style. The upperclass Italians know and admire classicism and how to interpret it in the modern day.
Its iconic silhouette and consistent adherence to it are the heart and soul of A&S.
John Hitchcock is a wonderful cutter with an uncanny eye and wonderful, traditional sense of style and proportion. His continued management of A&S is essential to preserving its traditions.
I look forward to learning more about the inside story of A&S and its future plans. Perhaps an interview with John Hitchcock , and even A&S owners, would be in order at some time. I think that there can be no better source than LL to get the facts straight on A&S, objectively and without sentimentality.
Infact, that would make a wonderful project to include some of the other traditional powerhouses of men's style such as Caraceni, Rubinacci and on.....
Has anyone here attending English Cut at Pitti? I would love to see some photos of what A&S presented as well as the other SR houses.
It is interesting to read of the Italians continued admiration for English Men's Style. The upperclass Italians know and admire classicism and how to interpret it in the modern day.
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Guest
A fascinating debate.
Until last year I had made a few forays into MTM and had always owned half a dozen or so RTW suits and a few odd jackets. Last spring, having considered bespoke for some time, but before I'd signed up to LL (and therefore, as I now see it, in a state of some ignorance!) I took the plunge and spent what seemed like a king's ransom on a bespoke suit.
The end result was magnificent, and I have been back since to make further purchases. The service is slightly old fashioned, but the results are faultless. A good example relates to a pair of trousers I recently ordered. At my fitting I didn't feel entirely happy but couldn't put my finger on why. A week later, discussing it with my other half, the reason dawned on me and I phoned to request the change. By then, the trousers had been finished and it was too late to change them without ruining them. What did my tailor do? He made an entirely new pair according to my revised request. Not only that, but he gave me the original pair free of charge.
So, I am a true bespoke convert, and while I will certainly continue to buy RTW for some items, for suits and jackets I would rather go without for as long as it takes to save for the real thing.
Sartorius.[/list]
Until last year I had made a few forays into MTM and had always owned half a dozen or so RTW suits and a few odd jackets. Last spring, having considered bespoke for some time, but before I'd signed up to LL (and therefore, as I now see it, in a state of some ignorance!) I took the plunge and spent what seemed like a king's ransom on a bespoke suit.
The end result was magnificent, and I have been back since to make further purchases. The service is slightly old fashioned, but the results are faultless. A good example relates to a pair of trousers I recently ordered. At my fitting I didn't feel entirely happy but couldn't put my finger on why. A week later, discussing it with my other half, the reason dawned on me and I phoned to request the change. By then, the trousers had been finished and it was too late to change them without ruining them. What did my tailor do? He made an entirely new pair according to my revised request. Not only that, but he gave me the original pair free of charge.
So, I am a true bespoke convert, and while I will certainly continue to buy RTW for some items, for suits and jackets I would rather go without for as long as it takes to save for the real thing.
Sartorius.[/list]
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Guest
To replace a pair of trousers : that's an example of wonderful customer service, sartorius, and damn unusual these days.
A&S is seems to be emerging from its cocoon; it is attending trade shows at Pitti, it is granting interviews (most recently to manton) and offering tours of its backroom tailoring operation. And on.
It even seems to be willing to tweak its famous silhouette.
AS has a wonderful future and a whole new generation of bespoke aficionados to beguile and confound.
A&S is seems to be emerging from its cocoon; it is attending trade shows at Pitti, it is granting interviews (most recently to manton) and offering tours of its backroom tailoring operation. And on.
It even seems to be willing to tweak its famous silhouette.
AS has a wonderful future and a whole new generation of bespoke aficionados to beguile and confound.
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Guest
I think we all acknowledge that spending £3000 on a suit is a daunting prospect for a first timer, even if you can afford it. Particularly when you are relying on an imperfect human being to construct the end product. To my mind, however, these things should not be so daunting as to put people off, and I hope one of the functions of this wonderful forum is to encourage those who are considering bespoke to take that first step.
As a bespoke customer myself I would simply say this: just as you would if you were buying a state of the art hi-fi, use a well known name. You want to be sure you get the best product, but just as importantly that you're going to get impeccable after sales service.
To those who have expressed concerns about being disappointed, I would ask you to bear in mind that if you are paying top dollar for something, you have a right to expect a product with which you are entirely satisfied - even if it takes 6 fittings and several changes of mind along the way to get there. One of the great changes in the Row in recent years is a democratisation of bespoke - as the previous contributor noted, even the big names are having to change with the times. So while some houses may have their own style, that should not mean they are wedded to one style only. Your tailor can of course only make you what you ask him to make, but given a fairly broad brief a good tailor will be able to make almost anything.
So, I would encourage everyone to do what I did - do your research, decide what you want, and take the plunge.
Sartorius
As a bespoke customer myself I would simply say this: just as you would if you were buying a state of the art hi-fi, use a well known name. You want to be sure you get the best product, but just as importantly that you're going to get impeccable after sales service.
To those who have expressed concerns about being disappointed, I would ask you to bear in mind that if you are paying top dollar for something, you have a right to expect a product with which you are entirely satisfied - even if it takes 6 fittings and several changes of mind along the way to get there. One of the great changes in the Row in recent years is a democratisation of bespoke - as the previous contributor noted, even the big names are having to change with the times. So while some houses may have their own style, that should not mean they are wedded to one style only. Your tailor can of course only make you what you ask him to make, but given a fairly broad brief a good tailor will be able to make almost anything.
So, I would encourage everyone to do what I did - do your research, decide what you want, and take the plunge.
Sartorius
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Guest
Although there is no information about prices.... i have just learned from the AAAC forums that the A&S website is finally operational. It seems that there is still a 'Visit Our Workrooms' section that is 'coming soon' though.
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Guest
I am working as a tailor and have only recently joined LL and I find this discussion very interesting.
The people who do most of the work are we tailors. Sure the cutter is responsible for the pattern and the fittings, but it is the tailor who makes something that covers a 3dimensional body out of a flat piece of cloth.
And still we tailors are the worst paid in the chain, no matter how big the company's name is.
This has been the case since the profession has evolved to the art it has been ever since.
To tell the truth, I would have to save my money for a long time to have a suit made at SR, Milano or Napoli, and I'm glad I don't have to. I can do them on my own, just the way I like them!
But it is not our work, that costs the money, not even the cloth(although it can make a great part of it).
So, what do you pay for? Is it the service? You might get an equal or even better service somewhere else!
It's the name, the brand. The possibility to tell or show others, that you can afford the big names! Are they always well made for the price? For what I saw the answer has to be: No! Sometimes they not even fit well!
Still, Bespoke is useful, as it preserves our profession, because no other can do it but a qualified tailor! But we are a dying breed in the western world, causing the prices for
bespoke most likely to rise even more!
So maybe, just maybe, one day in the not so distant future you will all be travelling to Romania!
SG
The people who do most of the work are we tailors. Sure the cutter is responsible for the pattern and the fittings, but it is the tailor who makes something that covers a 3dimensional body out of a flat piece of cloth.
And still we tailors are the worst paid in the chain, no matter how big the company's name is.
This has been the case since the profession has evolved to the art it has been ever since.
To tell the truth, I would have to save my money for a long time to have a suit made at SR, Milano or Napoli, and I'm glad I don't have to. I can do them on my own, just the way I like them!
But it is not our work, that costs the money, not even the cloth(although it can make a great part of it).
So, what do you pay for? Is it the service? You might get an equal or even better service somewhere else!
It's the name, the brand. The possibility to tell or show others, that you can afford the big names! Are they always well made for the price? For what I saw the answer has to be: No! Sometimes they not even fit well!
Still, Bespoke is useful, as it preserves our profession, because no other can do it but a qualified tailor! But we are a dying breed in the western world, causing the prices for
bespoke most likely to rise even more!
So maybe, just maybe, one day in the not so distant future you will all be travelling to Romania!
SG
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Guest
There is no need to consider A&S any longer.
Just refer to some of the photos here in London Lounge of their poorly designed sack suits.
I don't understand who has an interest in perpetuating the A&S myth; they are living on past glory, some 70 years past.
Best look elsewhere, regardless the price.
Just refer to some of the photos here in London Lounge of their poorly designed sack suits.
I don't understand who has an interest in perpetuating the A&S myth; they are living on past glory, some 70 years past.
Best look elsewhere, regardless the price.
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